Bmr wrote:

Cute post Bobby 1 ....dealership sucks but I have no idea what I'm DOING. Don't take it to heart I'm trying to get banned from this shit show Of AcMoC

LOL.  It's that bad anymore?  I read in another thread that people are not getting return calls, parts, etc.  I don't know about any of that.  But as to my thread, I can certainly see how someone might get the impression I have no clue.  I have learned not to share my actual experience level and education as people find it as pissing arrogance.  I obviously have no experience diving this deep in a D7, but I can assure you, my mental gears are crossing the Ts to give this bird the best chance at another life.  

But as to the dealer stuff, yes, I actually own two other CATs due to their handy work.  One of which prompted a nice lunch with the district brass after I combed their work.  One direction was a hush order, another was a job offer.  I firmly believe some things were missed when working on the 7.  

 

Hi bobby1,
have read back to find the pix of the magnetic screens--BE aware that a greater percentage of the fine black rubbish stuck to the magnets may not be magnetic or ferrous material--Cat has a Service Magazine article, that I am yet to find, but was told about it at Cat Schools in the past and seems like if I recall correctly was in the order of 70% non-magnetic sludge.
Use a rag to wipe some of the crud off the magnets and then run a magnet over the rag and sludge and see what you find--things may not be as bad as first thought.

Getting coolant free oil into the system with clean filters and screens and do some gentle test runs keeping an eye on the magnetic screens would be a way of troubleshooting to begin with.
If the pump suction screens were clogged enough then pump suction restriction at higher RPM's could cause clutch slippage and steer issues--for Safety reasons oil is first sent to the steer/brake circuit before the trans gets any --you need to be able to control the machine before you drive it so the trans could be starved some of oil.

The fan belt jumping off issue can be as simple as wear in the bushings of the belt tensioner arm pivot causing mis-alignment of the belts, weak tensioner springs could be an issue also.
See scans below for testing the air flow thru the radiator as per a Cat Special Instruction if overheating remains an issue.

We can put up Tans and T/C test pressures in due course to see if you are getting good oil flow and pressure--a leaking steer/brake system can be blocked out and trans/T/C testing done carefully as you will not have brakes etc.---we used to do this in clear area and gently run the machine back and forth to load it up when things looked to be OK we ran the blade into the test area dirt heap to stall or load the machine.
Due for anti Vietnam meds so info is coming fast--need to slow down some.

A reversible fan--has blades that can be periodically reversed-- we found with high hours of use the keys inside the big hub of the unit would wear themselves and the slots they engage with and so the blades flatten out--have less pitch-- and so the air flow is diminished hich can also cause overheating due to low air flows thru the radiator core.

Keep us informed as you are doing and we will get there.
Regards,
Eddie B.

Really appreciate the paged EDB! I do plan to go ahead and remove the engine cooler while the cooling system is down and inspect that. I am not yet sure what heating issues were experienced but this machine will get very careful rehab before any serious work that would cause a heating concern unless there is an obvious issue such as Tstats or something.

Curious where you are getting these pages from? That seems like a much better resource than the 75E military books I have. I always appreciate when CAT gives a pile of test criteria just as delta T across the radiator!

When I can finally do a test fire, I intend to have a pressure gauge right on the trans pump test port because there is no point looking at steer clutch pressures if the pump is falling down. My gut says good oil and clean screens will return the pressures to normal. But I STILL have massive concerns with the clutch materials subjected to coolant. I probably would not care too much to just have to do the steer clutches, but I might draw the line having the pull the trans and do every single clutch pack in there!

But.....when I tested the engine, I was shocked! It fired right up, no white smoke, no blowby, and glows don't even work right now. New TC, actually many new parts. Hell, if you saw the grousers, you would say they were new! I am just hoping and praying!

Hi bobby1,
scans are from my files that I used at the Dealer for such testing and are mostly from Caterpillar Special Instructions that go with Test Meters etc. that Cat recommend the Dealer buy from them.

Cat were good at supplying necessary data for testing/troubleshooting for Dealer personnel--data also was given out as handouts when attending Caterpillar run Training Schools out at Caterpillar of Australia down under here.

I think the air flow data SI and several others came to me when attending an Engine Problem Diagnosis Course back in mid 1982.
Cheers,
Eddie B.

EDB, I do have a direct question. I have worked hard to drain off the coolant from the system that has settled to the bottom. I did this for a reason because I want to know how many gallons I can account for. My question is whether you would swap all the oil at this point, or test with old oil plus a top up? I only ask because the price of oil is stupid! It occurred to me that due to the time sitting, the oil and water have had ample time to separate. The oil is black, it is not nice looking stuff, but maybe the right play for a quick test fire? I'd just like to see it jog and turn a bit. I am already against a wall having to buy a brand new cooler just to test it.

And that brings me to my next concern of coolant system flush? We are walking into winter here. temps dropping into freezing as soon as next week. Anything I do, I either need a little bit of freeze protection or drain. There is no way I will waste my time until I pressure test the cooling system on the machine. Too many question marks here.

Hi bobby1,
yes, a bit of a dilemma to know what to do with the Trans oil--way back I saw my Dad put tubs of oil on the gas stove and heat them gently to drive out any water--glycol coolant may be a different kettle of fish as I have no experience of it down under.

Dad told me one time that during WW2 oil was hard to get and sometimes he filtered old gearbox and diff oil thru an old felt hat to strain out the metal fragments after he welded in new teeth due to no parts availability, Dad also mentioned doing the same trick with engine oil in a pinch.

Maybe run the oil you can gather from draining thru a filter a few times and see if coolant will come out of suspension.
You could re-purpose your existing trans filters using an auxiliary independent pump to pump and so filter the oil from one container to another to save on a total refill with new oil for a gentle test as you describe.

A quick flush of the case bottoms with some diesel may or may not help flush out some coolant laying there.

I guess if it were mine I would be looking at the so called cheap skate way out to see if you have a viable project or not.

Regards,
Eddie B.

LOL, I think you know where I am coming from. It's maybe not as much about cost, as the "what are we really doing" question regarding this first oil change. Machine has sat for many months so even metal has settled at this point. I figure no matter what I do, I won't get every drop of coolant out right now. my only objective is to prove it will move and turn without crazy sounds. Getting any remaining coolant moving through the old oil is ideal.

But great minds think alike! I really need to build a "crash cart". An oil filtration system like CAT uses for disasters. Rather than buy one, I was thinking of building one with known cheap filters. Like, can I get filter housings for old mining CATs or D9s? lol I will have to think about this. I would not mind crash carting for a bit, but we are also talking about $200 of cheap oil, assuming 20gal is enough to run it? Maybe 25?

Bobby1, I suspect the material you are seeing is not clutch material as the clutch plates are steel and sintered bronze, brake material is fibrous. Black oil will be from overheating and brake band material and burnt oil.

\Wombat

Wombat wrote:

Bobby1, I suspect the material you are seeing is not clutch material as the clutch plates are steel and sintered bronze, brake material is fibrous. Black oil will be from overheating and brake band material and burnt oil.

\Wombat

There is some good info I didn't know!  Is that the same for the steering and trans clutch packs?  Yeah, that is quite a different deal!  Is the clutch material glued in place or riveted?  

I do know per the invoices that the brakes were excessively worn and were just rebanded.  As I understand it, the brakes have to come off to get the steer clutches out?  So an obvious time to replace?