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- D2-5U13753 - master pins - please check my understanding
D2-5U13753 - master pins - please check my understanding
7 years 4 months ago #168298
by neil
Cheers,
Neil
Pittsford, NY
D2-5U13753 - master pins - please check my understanding was created by neil
Per the serviceman's reference book, there are two master pin styles listed:
- early - a plug in each end with a 9/16 fine thread. Each plug is pulled out of its respective end of the master pin
- later - a plug in each end, both cone-shaped with one plug larger than the other. To remove, smaller plug is driven towards larger plug and then both are driven out of larger end
Then I understand the currently available master pin (not referenced in my Form 30441) is a waisted interference fit, with no plugs, and is driven for both installation and removal.
I think I have the early pin style on my 5U as I can see one has what looks like thread inside a plug inside the pin on one end, and the other end looks like the plug is missing.
The other pin looks like it has a broken off bolt in one plug, and the other plugs looks completely missing. The link bosses seem a little pounded in which might be aiding retention (perhaps non-intentionally).
If I can get both early style master pins out, are new plugs available?
- early - a plug in each end with a 9/16 fine thread. Each plug is pulled out of its respective end of the master pin
- later - a plug in each end, both cone-shaped with one plug larger than the other. To remove, smaller plug is driven towards larger plug and then both are driven out of larger end
Then I understand the currently available master pin (not referenced in my Form 30441) is a waisted interference fit, with no plugs, and is driven for both installation and removal.
I think I have the early pin style on my 5U as I can see one has what looks like thread inside a plug inside the pin on one end, and the other end looks like the plug is missing.
The other pin looks like it has a broken off bolt in one plug, and the other plugs looks completely missing. The link bosses seem a little pounded in which might be aiding retention (perhaps non-intentionally).
If I can get both early style master pins out, are new plugs available?
Cheers,
Neil
Pittsford, NY
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7 years 4 months ago #168300
by dpendzic
D2, D3, D4, D6, 941B, Cat 15
Hancock Ma and Moriches NY
Replied by dpendzic on topic D2-5U13753 - master pins - please check my understanding
Neil--i got the new style pins from Cat and they were about $11--pounded in fairly easy but have not moved out
D2, D3, D4, D6, 941B, Cat 15
Hancock Ma and Moriches NY
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- Riverina d4
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7 years 4 months ago #168302
by Riverina d4
On the early,If not available you could get some machined up. That way if needed you can make them a bit bigger on the outside diameter to make a worn hole in a link assembly tight on the pin.I found the best way to remove plugs was to weld a bolt on to the end of my slide hammer and work on them at the front lower side of the front Idler.
Hope this helps
Replied by Riverina d4 on topic Plugs
Per the serviceman's reference book, there are two master pin styles listed:
- early - a plug in each end with a 9/16 fine thread. Each plug is pulled out of its respective end of the master pin
- later - a plug in each end, both cone-shaped with one plug larger than the other. To remove, smaller plug is driven towards larger plug and then both are driven out of larger end
Then I understand the currently available master pin (not referenced in my Form 30441) is a waisted interference fit, with no plugs, and is driven for both installation and removal.
I think I have the early pin style on my 5U as I can see one has what looks like thread inside a plug inside the pin on one end, and the other end looks like the plug is missing.
The other pin looks like it has a broken off bolt in one plug, and the other plugs looks completely missing. The link bosses seem a little pounded in which might be aiding retention (perhaps non-intentionally).
If I can get both early style master pins out, are new plugs available?
On the early,If not available you could get some machined up. That way if needed you can make them a bit bigger on the outside diameter to make a worn hole in a link assembly tight on the pin.I found the best way to remove plugs was to weld a bolt on to the end of my slide hammer and work on them at the front lower side of the front Idler.
Hope this helps
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7 years 4 months ago #168307
by D2MOVA
Replied by D2MOVA on topic D2-5U13753 - master pins - please check my understanding
When you get the new plugs etc tap the plug with the corner of a file they will then grab and wont shift a bit harder to get out though
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7 years 4 months ago #168316
by drujinin
There was a thread where the fellow said he got new plugs, the larger ones I believe? He had a part number listed. I always thought the 2 different sized ones were the earlier pins but no matter. Last pin I bought using the old part number upgraded to the interference pin. I had a tough time getting it in working alone.
There have been a couple of threads over the years referencing D2 pin removal. I put some tips in the maintenance / repair sticky on tricks I have found successful!
There have been a couple of threads over the years referencing D2 pin removal. I put some tips in the maintenance / repair sticky on tricks I have found successful!
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7 years 4 months ago #168318
by neil
Cheers,
Neil
Pittsford, NY
Replied by neil on topic D2-5U13753 - master pins - please check my understanding
Thanks guys. The question I should have also asked is, even if I can get new early-style plugs (each is withdrawn from its respective end), would I still be better to fit the third generation, no-plug waisted pin?
Cheers,
Neil
Pittsford, NY
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7 years 4 months ago #168322
by dpendzic
D2, D3, D4, D6, 941B, Cat 15
Hancock Ma and Moriches NY
Replied by dpendzic on topic D2-5U13753 - master pins - please check my understanding
My Cat dealer said the old style pins and tapered plugs were discontinued so i just went with the new style solid pin--
D2, D3, D4, D6, 941B, Cat 15
Hancock Ma and Moriches NY
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- Riverina d4
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7 years 4 months ago #168332
by Riverina d4
I guess it comes down to personal choice Neil. I would go with the old plug style every day of the week. That way there is no bashing,driving,heating etc required to fit or remove master pins.I got the new third generation pin with a pin and bush kit for my D2 but I had two new, old style, two dowels the same size master pins in my box of spares so I used them.
But I'm a little old fashioned LOL
Replied by Riverina d4 on topic D2-5U13753 - master pins - please check my understanding
Thanks guys. The question I should have also asked is, even if I can get new early-style plugs (each is withdrawn from its respective end), would I still be better to fit the third generation, no-plug waisted pin?
I guess it comes down to personal choice Neil. I would go with the old plug style every day of the week. That way there is no bashing,driving,heating etc required to fit or remove master pins.I got the new third generation pin with a pin and bush kit for my D2 but I had two new, old style, two dowels the same size master pins in my box of spares so I used them.
But I'm a little old fashioned LOL
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7 years 4 months ago #168336
by neil
Cheers,
Neil
Pittsford, NY
Replied by neil on topic D2-5U13753 - master pins - please check my understanding
I like the sound of that! Turns out there's four styles - prior to the U-series pins listed above, the J-series had a pin with a cotter through it, which changed to the plug-style about 3J4000. That one sounds even easier! : )
I hope that's what my 3J has
I hope that's what my 3J has
Cheers,
Neil
Pittsford, NY
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7 years 4 months ago #168414
by neil
Cheers,
Neil
Pittsford, NY
Replied by neil on topic D2-5U13753 - master pins - please check my understanding
Next question - I need to remove the blade rear mounting frames, retained by eight large bolts (take a 1" socket). Of course they're as tight as buggery and my cheap 3/4 drive socket set and 5 foot cheater won't move them. Options that I've thought of are:
- get the tire shop truck to come round with the 1 inch rattle gun. Don't know if it would even look at these bolts given the 5' cheater didn't even make them squeak
- use my gas axe to blow the center out of the bolts and let them cool down, perhaps shrinking a bit at the same time. The bolts are about 2 inches long so I don't actually know if I can blow that far through into the bolt. Access to the other side is difficult.
- drill them and heat/shrink them. This option would suck effort-wise....
- cut the heads off the bolts because that will accomplish the goal of removing the frames. Use some technique to remove the bolt stubs (I can probably blow through them with the gas axe because at that point they'll be only about an inch long)
Any suggestions folks? Get a bigger socket set and a longer cheater? Buy a 2018 model year D3? Take up macrame instead? : )
- get the tire shop truck to come round with the 1 inch rattle gun. Don't know if it would even look at these bolts given the 5' cheater didn't even make them squeak
- use my gas axe to blow the center out of the bolts and let them cool down, perhaps shrinking a bit at the same time. The bolts are about 2 inches long so I don't actually know if I can blow that far through into the bolt. Access to the other side is difficult.
- drill them and heat/shrink them. This option would suck effort-wise....
- cut the heads off the bolts because that will accomplish the goal of removing the frames. Use some technique to remove the bolt stubs (I can probably blow through them with the gas axe because at that point they'll be only about an inch long)
Any suggestions folks? Get a bigger socket set and a longer cheater? Buy a 2018 model year D3? Take up macrame instead? : )
Cheers,
Neil
Pittsford, NY
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