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pony motor mag
pony motor mag
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3 years 6 months ago #228475
by mog5858
Yes, Dan I still having "fun" I guess that why we have more than one project so we get to have a lot of fun when one is being too much fun. well, I think I going to pull the pony off so I can take the side cover off and retime all the gears plus I can then pull the pinon assembly and make sure everything is good inside it too. this pony has never run right from owning it. I moved the timing gear 3-4 teeth from where and it has not seemed to make any difference will run on all of them. I might look for a different carb to try on it. I could have the main fuel jet anywhere from 1/2 out to 2 turns and not much change. it will start and run without the choke. for as rich, as it's running I have not had problems with it flood the cylinders and needing to use the petcocks. I running 92 octane with no ethanol in it. plugs were gaped to just over .030 so I brought them back down to .025. The only things left are new plugs/wires or change the mag with the one-off my d4600 but I think they are a little different as the 4600 sits straight up and the 318 is on a 30 slope. it has great compression you can't roll over tdc by hand. thanks for all the help EDB you saved me more than one time. the link is to a youtube video of it running.
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3 years 6 months ago #228477
by neil
Definitely change the plug wires Martin although I don't think that's your problem. I know you say it's not rich but it sure sounds that way and the black smoke is also a tell-tale. Can you remove the pony air cleaner as a trial in case that or the tube is choking it down. If you remove the air cleaner to carb tube, that will remove that from the equation. It might be that the float level is too high so your main jet adjustment has little effect.
Also, restore the timing before proceeding to how it should be because we don't want to be fighting two things. A mag swap also seems like a quick way to rule the mag out (assuming the "new" mag doesn't also have problems).
Cheers,
Neil
Pittsford, NY
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3 years 6 months ago #228483
by mog5858
it's running with the air cleaner off right now. I going to recheck the float height or change the float bowl out for one out of my parts stash.
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3 years 6 months ago #228507
by edb
Hi Mog5858,
your pony settled and ran at what sounded at around low idle smoothly, likely due to the fuel level in the carby bowl going down past the correct fuel level as it ran out of fuel--this can be an indication of of high fuel level.
I would remove the top off the carby float bowl and check/adjust the float height as outlined in the yellow SRB--see scan below.
The scan below is for a D4600 but the carb is essentually the same except for the main jet 90# bellcrank addition to the later carbs that reverses the action of the main jet needle adjster screw, screw turned inwards to richen the mixture and outwards to weaken the mixture-- if the 90# bellcrank is bent then you may need near full choke to run at High Idle ---having a high fuel level in the bowl "may" negate the choke usage but cause what you are experiencing by causing an uncontrolable rich mixture--my guess work.
As a hint, I found that was easier to turn the float chamber top upside down so gravity exerts a light closing force to the float and needle to do the measuring of the float height to the under surface of the chamber top.--bending the float arm can change the float level but be carefull not to destroy the float. Also fibre washers used as shims under the brass needle seat can vary the float height too witout stressing things.
In the past I have found that removing the needle seat from the carb bowl cover did not expose fibrous material trapped behind the fuel inlet elbow--when the elbow was removed I found this foreign hair like material that interfered with regular closing of the needle and so caused erratic fuel levels in the carb bowl--a few minutes for peace of mind can be beneficial as that issue can be ruled out.
Your experience may vary.
Cheers,
Eddie B.
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3 years 6 months ago #228643
by mog5858
I think 🤔 I might have created some of my own problems. I was thinking that the M's on the timing gears would lineup when timing the mag but as the mag line on the flywheel is before tdc that's will not be the case. When my base gasket get in from caterpillar I will give it a try. I might switch out a different carburetor to. It's got to be something simple I missing as it did idle well better then most I seen and own.
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3 years 6 months ago #228652
by neil
Martin, in your second-to-last photo, is that actually a timing mark on the crank gear that's off to the side by the idler? That looks like the timing mark to me, which should align with the C mark on the camshaft gear. You can verify whether it's close by pulling off one of the cylinder heads, and check that during one of the two TDC events, that the valves are rocking. If the valves rock when the piston's halfway down the cylinder or anywhere that's not TDC, then the valve timing is incorrect. Note that the idler gear has no timing relationship to the crank, if it's like the D2/D4 pony
Cheers,
Neil
Pittsford, NY
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3 years 6 months ago #228674
by edb
Hi Team,
something weird going on with the reply as this is the second reply to this article to get it to take.
The D4600 and D318 pony engine timing gears are the same layout and both SRB's show the same photos and text but the D318 one is smaller and more blurry so have copied a scan from the D4600 SRB.
On these ponies the idler gear is timed as it drives the small magneto tang slotted drive gear and so the "I" marks are used for this pair of gears.
The "C" marks align the crank and cam gears--note these engines only have one crankshaft drive/timing gear key so cannot be 180 # out of time like their samller horizontal pony counterparts if the C on the gear is not aligned to the C on the crankshaft.
Hope this helps,
Cheers,
Eddie B.
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3 years 6 months ago #228681
by neil
Thanks Eddie for confirming that - added that nugget of knowledge to the noggin' : ) Apologies for adding static to the discussion Martin - it looked a bit odd to me, but since your gear timing is correct, is the mag correctly configured as well?
I'm still thinking it's rich due to that smoke and just the way it sounds to be laboring under too much fuel.
Cheers,
Neil
Pittsford, NY
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3 years 6 months ago #228692
by Fat Dan
I'm hitting and missing about as bad as your pony I'll be backin later
ACMOC Member
Traxcavator: 60, 955E 12A08263; 57, 955C 12A04040; 57, 955C 12A03563.
1954 No.12 Diesel Motor Grader 8T14777.
1945 No.12 Diesel Motor Grader 9K9320; 9K9982
1944-46 Adams Model No. 311 Motor Grader
1943 IH T9 Tractor w/ Bullgrader Blade
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3 years 5 months ago #229326
by mog5858
sorry, it takin so long to get back on this but I now have the pony back on and time. I also went through the pinion drive clutch when I had the pony off and found some broken brass clutch plates when I was in there. on holidays and trying to get this going 2 questions it has the newer style heads on the pony with the plug in the middle but the parts book only show the angle head with 18mm plugs not the small 14mm that are on it. the spark plugs are Champion J8C I going to try and get some new ones but it is a little unclear if they are the right ones. I change flote bowls to see if that would help and no change it starts easy but is very rich.
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