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Where is a reliable place to rebuild a fuel injection pump

Where is a reliable place to rebuild a fuel injection pump

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pjcat
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D6C LGP 90B1849 engine 3306 44V8821
I am at the point to rebuild my FIP. I took it off the machine and send it to the only reliable shop her in Hawaii which is on another Island. Today I talked to the mechanic and he told me that he can not drive the pump, because it is to old; he is not equipped to run such an old pump. He would have priced me around $1500.- at the lower end. Called CAT and they told me for a rebuilt pump would be $2600.- Called Peterson in California; the mechanic told me between $2000-2500.- and turnover around 4 weeks.
My question is if anybody here knows of a good, reliable shop where some good old-timers would lay on hand on that pump? And maybe also to a reasonable price and turnover time? Could be anyplace on the mainland, I would just ship it there.

Here's a pic of the pump and also part# 5S7999 for pump housing and 7S8834 for governor group.

Thanks a lot.


[attachment=25313]FIP1.jpg[/attachment]
Attachment
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Wed, Sep 24, 2014 1:50 PM
bob
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Are you sure it needs rebuilding? Unless it's worn out badly it can come back with worse parts in it than it has now. They work okay under load but idle very rough. Built to Cat specifications(not by Cat) says it all.
Later Bob
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Wed, Sep 24, 2014 8:23 PM
old-iron-habit
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Reply to bob:
Are you sure it needs rebuilding? Unless it's worn out badly it can come back with worse parts in it than it has now. They work okay under load but idle very rough. Built to Cat specifications(not by Cat) says it all.
Later Bob
Have you contacted Bill Walters here on the ACMOC site.
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Wed, Sep 24, 2014 8:32 PM
Old Magnet
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Reply to old-iron-habit:
Have you contacted Bill Walters here on the ACMOC site.
What symptoms have you experienced that makes you think the unit needs rebuilding? What is the total operating hours on the machine?
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Wed, Sep 24, 2014 10:46 PM
pjcat
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Reply to old-iron-habit:
Have you contacted Bill Walters here on the ACMOC site.


No I did not. How can I do that?
Thanks
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Thu, Sep 25, 2014 12:39 AM
pjcat
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Reply to Old Magnet:
What symptoms have you experienced that makes you think the unit needs rebuilding? What is the total operating hours on the machine?


We own this machine since about 1.5 years. The meter on the engine reads 3340h which is for sure not true for a machine close to 40 years old. Somebody has put an electronic meter on the dash which reads 2800h, but this also doesn't help much. I don't really know the history of this machine but I could bet that the injection pump has never been serviced.

Last January we had a catastrophic engine failure, probably due to overheating. We rebuilt the whole engine; new head, crank, cam, pistons, liners, basically internally everything new. Also got a new turbo. When we test run her she sounded ok and seemed to be fine. Put her back in the machine and started to use her. But when she heated up and was under load she made a lot of noise and was in lass than 10min over 200º. So I changed all the injectors, which helped a lot: the noise considerably got better, but its still there and I only hear it when I rev her up and put her under load. She still heats up to fast by doing just a little work with it and to me she has a lack of power.

I put a new temperature gauge to be sure on that and inspected the whole cooling system, opened pump and radiator and inspected and cleaned. So the overheating is not coming from the cooling system.
So the only thing left is the injection pump and my mechanic is also telling me to go for the pump; either rebuilt this one or replace it with another rebuilt one.
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Thu, Sep 25, 2014 12:58 AM
Old Magnet
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Reply to pjcat:


We own this machine since about 1.5 years. The meter on the engine reads 3340h which is for sure not true for a machine close to 40 years old. Somebody has put an electronic meter on the dash which reads 2800h, but this also doesn't help much. I don't really know the history of this machine but I could bet that the injection pump has never been serviced.

Last January we had a catastrophic engine failure, probably due to overheating. We rebuilt the whole engine; new head, crank, cam, pistons, liners, basically internally everything new. Also got a new turbo. When we test run her she sounded ok and seemed to be fine. Put her back in the machine and started to use her. But when she heated up and was under load she made a lot of noise and was in lass than 10min over 200º. So I changed all the injectors, which helped a lot: the noise considerably got better, but its still there and I only hear it when I rev her up and put her under load. She still heats up to fast by doing just a little work with it and to me she has a lack of power.

I put a new temperature gauge to be sure on that and inspected the whole cooling system, opened pump and radiator and inspected and cleaned. So the overheating is not coming from the cooling system.
So the only thing left is the injection pump and my mechanic is also telling me to go for the pump; either rebuilt this one or replace it with another rebuilt one.
Even if you add the two hour meters together that's not a lot of hours.
Seems more like an injection pump timing issue.
Was timing set with proper fixture when/if pump was removed during overhaul? May have been off timing to begin with.
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Thu, Sep 25, 2014 2:10 AM
pjcat
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Reply to Old Magnet:
Even if you add the two hour meters together that's not a lot of hours.
Seems more like an injection pump timing issue.
Was timing set with proper fixture when/if pump was removed during overhaul? May have been off timing to begin with.
[quote="Old Magnet"]Even if you add the two hour meters together that's not a lot of hours.
Seems more like an injection pump timing issue.
Was timing set with proper fixture when/if pump was removed during overhaul? May have been off timing to begin with.[/quote]

Yes we used the timing tool from CAT, I'm sure the timing is ok. Without a load the engine seems to be ok, at least she sounds ok. But under load she will give in. We think whatever caused the engine failure, overheating or oil pump failure, also had an impact on the FIP.
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Thu, Sep 25, 2014 3:16 AM
pjcat
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Reply to pjcat:
[quote="Old Magnet"]Even if you add the two hour meters together that's not a lot of hours.
Seems more like an injection pump timing issue.
Was timing set with proper fixture when/if pump was removed during overhaul? May have been off timing to begin with.[/quote]

Yes we used the timing tool from CAT, I'm sure the timing is ok. Without a load the engine seems to be ok, at least she sounds ok. But under load she will give in. We think whatever caused the engine failure, overheating or oil pump failure, also had an impact on the FIP.
Update: Just talked to our CAT dealer again and now they told me they don't make rebuilts of this pump anymore. I can get the internal parts for it but not a whole pump. So my only way to go is to service my pump at a good shop.
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Thu, Sep 25, 2014 4:28 AM
BillWalter
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Reply to pjcat:
Update: Just talked to our CAT dealer again and now they told me they don't make rebuilts of this pump anymore. I can get the internal parts for it but not a whole pump. So my only way to go is to service my pump at a good shop.
That's too new of a pump for me to check. I'm like the other guys, I don't believe you have a pump problem. As for the heating; Your thermostat could be stuck shut or the coolant bypass line is plugged and not allowing warm coolant to flow past the thermostat. Timing could be another problem. If you had the engine spotted on TDC #1 cyl. compression stroke and the tool was holdong the gear in place, your pump should be in time. You could; remove # 1 fuel line from pump, pressurize fuel tank, throttle in low idle position, turn engine in direction of rotation, as you get close to #1 TDC mark on compression stroke, (both valves will be closed), just before reaching the TDC mark on flywheel, fuel will stop flowing from #1 pump----that would be point of injection. That would mean that pump is in "Time"
If the pump was installed one revolution off, the engine would run, but not very good. Foe example:you set the gear when the #1 piston was in the valve overlap position. I seen a 966 (same engine) set up that way and they ran it several days and scored all the pistons. It was done by a field mechanic who should have known better, but!!!! Stuff happens!! Good luck, Bill
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Thu, Sep 25, 2014 9:15 AM
pjcat
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Reply to BillWalter:
That's too new of a pump for me to check. I'm like the other guys, I don't believe you have a pump problem. As for the heating; Your thermostat could be stuck shut or the coolant bypass line is plugged and not allowing warm coolant to flow past the thermostat. Timing could be another problem. If you had the engine spotted on TDC #1 cyl. compression stroke and the tool was holdong the gear in place, your pump should be in time. You could; remove # 1 fuel line from pump, pressurize fuel tank, throttle in low idle position, turn engine in direction of rotation, as you get close to #1 TDC mark on compression stroke, (both valves will be closed), just before reaching the TDC mark on flywheel, fuel will stop flowing from #1 pump----that would be point of injection. That would mean that pump is in "Time"
If the pump was installed one revolution off, the engine would run, but not very good. Foe example:you set the gear when the #1 piston was in the valve overlap position. I seen a 966 (same engine) set up that way and they ran it several days and scored all the pistons. It was done by a field mechanic who should have known better, but!!!! Stuff happens!! Good luck, Bill
[quote="BillWalter"]That's too new of a pump for me to check. I'm like the other guys, I don't believe you have a pump problem. As for the heating; Your thermostat could be stuck shut or the coolant bypass line is plugged and not allowing warm coolant to flow past the thermostat. Timing could be another problem. If you had the engine spotted on TDC #1 cyl. compression stroke and the tool was holdong the gear in place, your pump should be in time. You could; remove # 1 fuel line from pump, pressurize fuel tank, throttle in low idle position, turn engine in direction of rotation, as you get close to #1 TDC mark on compression stroke, (both valves will be closed), just before reaching the TDC mark on flywheel, fuel will stop flowing from #1 pump----that would be point of injection. That would mean that pump is in "Time"
If the pump was installed one revolution off, the engine would run, but not very good. Foe example:you set the gear when the #1 piston was in the valve overlap position. I seen a 966 (same engine) set up that way and they ran it several days and scored all the pistons. It was done by a field mechanic who should have known better, but!!!! Stuff happens!! Good luck, Bill[/quote]

Wow, if this is pump is to new, ten what is an old one??? Pump problem: Don't you think that whatever caused the engine failure, either oil pump failure or overheating, could possibly also have affected the fuel pump?
I did check the thermostat and it does open; starts at 185º fully open at 195º. My cooling system seems to operate ok.
I think also the timing is ok: we followed CAT, put #1 at TDC, installed bolt through flywheel housing and installed timing fixture plate. I don't think the engine is one revolution off, she sounds and starts ok, only when she gets hot and under load it doesn't sound right.
Right now i don't have the pump available, so I cannot run the test you describe. My guess is that the plungers in the FIP have some wear, which is causing this trouble, but that's just a guess???
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Thu, Sep 25, 2014 2:34 PM
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