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trouble shooting my cat d330c

trouble shooting my cat d330c

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jprobyn
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i have and d330c cat power unit powering my vintage barber greene wheel trencher this is a working machine a has jobs waitin on it, however it wont run well enough to work

in the past two years it has had a random misfire off and on it will work for a few months then it will sit a month and there it is again and we dont know whats causing it

the motor has been completely rebuilt the injection pump has been gone through by two different shops multiple times
its had numurous new injectors and bodys new lines new precombustion chambers new gear lift pump and priming plunger
all have been carefully installed and checked buy several people and i have told many very sharp minds about my problem

i acts like air is entering before the injection pump but it will run perfect for the first three minutes when its cold and first couple seconds once its warm it does not seam to be afected by rpm it also make no diference weather its runing on bio fuel or strait petroleum deisel
i have checked and rechecked for entering air ive cracked line open fumeagated with either over every inch ran off it of remote fuel and nothing makes it better or worse


IF ANYONE can give some mor ideas or is located near the peoria il and would like to listen to it run

please feel free to call me at one 3 o nine two three ate 46 9o
my name is justin
thankyou
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Sun, Apr 8, 2012 2:19 AM
catsilver
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Have you checked fuel pressure under all conditions, does it drop when the misfire hapens?
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Sun, Apr 8, 2012 3:07 PM
bob
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Reply to catsilver:
Have you checked fuel pressure under all conditions, does it drop when the misfire hapens?
Justin, since it's in a trencher the fuel tank might be lower than the fuel pump. If this is the original engine it should be an industrial arrangement. That said due to the variables in fuel tank location all industrial engines should have a fuel return line to constantly bleed any air picked up back to the tank. If you have one make sure it's clear.
Next thing does the engine run smoother under a load? If it does then remove the small oval cover over the front of the rack, up where the pump mounts to the drive. Cover is held on by two bolts 1/2" hex(5/16 NC)bolts. Take the cover off and hold a very short pencil against the end of the rack to check for and stop pulsations.
Come back with what you find.
Later Bob
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Sun, Apr 8, 2012 7:52 PM
neil
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Reply to bob:
Justin, since it's in a trencher the fuel tank might be lower than the fuel pump. If this is the original engine it should be an industrial arrangement. That said due to the variables in fuel tank location all industrial engines should have a fuel return line to constantly bleed any air picked up back to the tank. If you have one make sure it's clear.
Next thing does the engine run smoother under a load? If it does then remove the small oval cover over the front of the rack, up where the pump mounts to the drive. Cover is held on by two bolts 1/2" hex(5/16 NC)bolts. Take the cover off and hold a very short pencil against the end of the rack to check for and stop pulsations.
Come back with what you find.
Later Bob
Also on the fuel side, plumb in a 2 gal tank above the engine with a decent size pipe to the transfer pump then run it and see if the symptoms still persist. Have you tried running it with the fuel cap off/loose to validate that it's not drawing a vacuum in the tank. Last thing you can do is pressurize the tank and see if that effects any change (only a couple of psi - do it with the tank 1/4 full so that the air pressure is easier to maintain).
When it runs properly, is there noticeable smoke and if so, what color is it?

Cheers,
Neil.
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Sun, Apr 8, 2012 8:53 PM
ol Grump
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Reply to neil:
Also on the fuel side, plumb in a 2 gal tank above the engine with a decent size pipe to the transfer pump then run it and see if the symptoms still persist. Have you tried running it with the fuel cap off/loose to validate that it's not drawing a vacuum in the tank. Last thing you can do is pressurize the tank and see if that effects any change (only a couple of psi - do it with the tank 1/4 full so that the air pressure is easier to maintain).
When it runs properly, is there noticeable smoke and if so, what color is it?

Cheers,
Neil.
Another place to check is the fuel tank itself. I've seen some surprising stuff in 'em and if a rag (or something else) happens to plug or partially plug the intake line in the tank the engine would act like what you're describing. Just another idea and place to check. . .
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Sun, Apr 8, 2012 9:11 PM
ccjersey
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Take loose the return line and put it in a can of clean fuel while running the engine. Might have to be a big can if you're going to do it for long! Watch for bubbles.

The old fuel lift lines can be worn enough where the ferrules are on them to allow air to enter. May have to seal with teflon tape wrapped on ferrule or just replace with hoses etc. \

The easy way to pressurize the tank is clamp a piece of inner tube over the filler spout of the tank which has the valve stem in it. Pump it up enough to bulge it out some.
D2-5J's, D6-9U's, D318 and D333 power units, 12E-99E grader, 922B & 944A wheel loaders, D330C generator set, DW20 water tanker and a bunch of Jersey cows to take care of in my spare time😄
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Sun, Apr 8, 2012 11:37 PM
Old Magnet
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Reply to ccjersey:
Take loose the return line and put it in a can of clean fuel while running the engine. Might have to be a big can if you're going to do it for long! Watch for bubbles.

The old fuel lift lines can be worn enough where the ferrules are on them to allow air to enter. May have to seal with teflon tape wrapped on ferrule or just replace with hoses etc. \

The easy way to pressurize the tank is clamp a piece of inner tube over the filler spout of the tank which has the valve stem in it. Pump it up enough to bulge it out some.
Seems you've tried all the obvious things.
You mention rebuilt engine. Irregular firing can be caused by the burning of excessive lubricating oil escaping past new rings which have not fully seated.
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Mon, Apr 9, 2012 12:02 AM
jprobyn
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Reply to catsilver:
Have you checked fuel pressure under all conditions, does it drop when the misfire hapens?



it always has 30- 50 psi as soon as its runing the gear pump has been replased and i have a pressure gage on top of the filter housing with a bleeder playing with that doesnt influence the mis fire at all
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Mon, Apr 9, 2012 8:42 PM
jprobyn
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Reply to bob:
Justin, since it's in a trencher the fuel tank might be lower than the fuel pump. If this is the original engine it should be an industrial arrangement. That said due to the variables in fuel tank location all industrial engines should have a fuel return line to constantly bleed any air picked up back to the tank. If you have one make sure it's clear.
Next thing does the engine run smoother under a load? If it does then remove the small oval cover over the front of the rack, up where the pump mounts to the drive. Cover is held on by two bolts 1/2" hex(5/16 NC)bolts. Take the cover off and hold a very short pencil against the end of the rack to check for and stop pulsations.
Come back with what you find.
Later Bob
[QUOTE=bob;90189]Justin, since it's in a trencher the fuel tank might be lower than the fuel pump. If this is the original engine it should be an industrial arrangement. That said due to the variables in fuel tank location all industrial engines should have a fuel return line to constantly bleed any air picked up back to the tank. If you have one make sure it's clear.
Next thing does the engine run smoother under a load? If it does then remove the small oval cover over the front of the rack, up where the pump mounts to the drive. Cover is held on by two bolts 1/2" hex(5/16 NC)bolts. Take the cover off and hold a very short pencil against the end of the rack to check for and stop pulsations.
Come back with what you find.
Later Bob[/QUOTE






i have replaced the fuel lines from tank to pump several times with no change the tank is located next to the engine with the top of it just above the seem between the oil pan and bottom of the block

the lines, retun and supply both come off the bottom of the tank the supply has a one inch stand pipe i have put a glass sediment bowl on it and it has alway kept some air in it but doesnt send it through to the pump
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Mon, Apr 9, 2012 8:50 PM
jprobyn
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Reply to neil:
Also on the fuel side, plumb in a 2 gal tank above the engine with a decent size pipe to the transfer pump then run it and see if the symptoms still persist. Have you tried running it with the fuel cap off/loose to validate that it's not drawing a vacuum in the tank. Last thing you can do is pressurize the tank and see if that effects any change (only a couple of psi - do it with the tank 1/4 full so that the air pressure is easier to maintain).
When it runs properly, is there noticeable smoke and if so, what color is it?

Cheers,
Neil.
[quote="Neil"]Also on the fuel side, plumb in a 2 gal tank above the engine with a decent size pipe to the transfer pump then run it and see if the symptoms still persist. Have you tried running it with the fuel cap off/loose to validate that it's not drawing a vacuum in the tank. Last thing you can do is pressurize the tank and see if that effects any change (only a couple of psi - do it with the tank 1/4 full so that the air pressure is easier to maintain).
When it runs properly, is there noticeable smoke and if so, what color is it?

Cheers,
Neil.[/quote]

i have never pressureized the tank how ever i have ran it off a bucket sitting just below the gear pump with clear line no air is getting in
and it doesnt smoke at all always burns clean
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Mon, Apr 9, 2012 8:54 PM
jprobyn
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Reply to Old Magnet:
Seems you've tried all the obvious things.
You mention rebuilt engine. Irregular firing can be caused by the burning of excessive lubricating oil escaping past new rings which have not fully seated.
[quote="Old Magnet"]Seems you've tried all the obvious things.
You mention rebuilt engine. Irregular firing can be caused by the burning of excessive lubricating oil escaping past new rings which have not fully seated.[/quote]




i have not yet checked for compression but if this was the case wouldnt it smoke or be putting fuel in my oil
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Mon, Apr 9, 2012 8:58 PM
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