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starting issue

starting issue

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budtoh3zo
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I thought i would start my own thread so i didnt hijack the d7 one. But i picked up a D4 7U earlier this year. It takes abit to get the diesel to light off. It has very little blow by when it is running has awsome power. When starting it seems to light off fairly even across all the cylinders but takes a few tries to get it lit up. It will blow fairly black as its starting up. Also when im cranking her over and start to open the fuel up it takes a few seconds before any smoke starts rolling out at all like its not getting fuel for the first probably 20 seconds then will get whiteish then start fireing and turn black. Also when cranking it over with the pup the fuel pressure gauge does not move untill the main engine starts cranking is that normal? thanks guys.
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Tue, Oct 12, 2010 9:57 AM
Sasquatch
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On my 5U D2 (which has a nearly identical fuel pump/filter setup as your machine) I can get the fuel pressure gauge to peg all the way to full pressure with just the pony cranking the diesel, that's with a very good pump and clean filters. If your pump is worn, or its pressure relief valve is crudded up, or if the spring is weak/broken it could account for your low fuel pressure when cranking. It would be a good idea to check your fuel filters too, if you get into that area. If you do a search here for those problems you should find lots of information from previous posts. Those are the things I'd be checking first.
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Tue, Oct 12, 2010 10:17 AM
Mike Walsh
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If you search this site you will find a lot of good info about your problem. You should have fuel and oil pressure when cranking the diesel with the pony motor. If you have good flow from the tank to the transfer pump, you ought to check the relief valve. Lots of info on that on the site. Next course would be to clean fuel tower and change fuel filters and then clean beyond to the injectors. If that doesn't improve the situation, search for info on the fuel rack. Last items would be injector lines and nozzles. Sorry to be so brief but there are better explanations already written to address any problem you have.
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Tue, Oct 12, 2010 10:26 AM
budtoh3zo
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Reply to Mike Walsh:
If you search this site you will find a lot of good info about your problem. You should have fuel and oil pressure when cranking the diesel with the pony motor. If you have good flow from the tank to the transfer pump, you ought to check the relief valve. Lots of info on that on the site. Next course would be to clean fuel tower and change fuel filters and then clean beyond to the injectors. If that doesn't improve the situation, search for info on the fuel rack. Last items would be injector lines and nozzles. Sorry to be so brief but there are better explanations already written to address any problem you have.
Thanks for the start. It builds oil pressure with the pup just not fuel and wasnt sure if it was suppost to with pup or not. I will look into it why its not building with just the pup now. Hope it's just as simple as the fuel filter. The rack moves freely checked that when i checked the drain for the pump as i had hi fuel dilution once.
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Tue, Oct 12, 2010 10:35 AM
Cysco
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Reply to budtoh3zo:
Thanks for the start. It builds oil pressure with the pup just not fuel and wasnt sure if it was suppost to with pup or not. I will look into it why its not building with just the pup now. Hope it's just as simple as the fuel filter. The rack moves freely checked that when i checked the drain for the pump as i had hi fuel dilution once.
My D2 5U was doing something similar to your D4 and it was a combination of rebuilding the fuel transfer pump and changing the filters that fixed the problem. It now runs like Toby's with the fuel pressure pegged out and starts easily.
Have a good evening.....Bill
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Tue, Oct 12, 2010 12:16 PM
D8PETE
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Reply to Cysco:
My D2 5U was doing something similar to your D4 and it was a combination of rebuilding the fuel transfer pump and changing the filters that fixed the problem. It now runs like Toby's with the fuel pressure pegged out and starts easily.
Have a good evening.....Bill
Cysco - Did you rebuild your own pump or did you send it out to be rebuilt? And if so who did you use?
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Tue, Oct 12, 2010 9:47 PM
Cysco
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Reply to D8PETE:
Cysco - Did you rebuild your own pump or did you send it out to be rebuilt? And if so who did you use?


D8PETE..... I was under the direction of several of the guys here diagnosing, disassembly and putting the parts back together.A local machine shop did the resurfacing of the contact areas that were damaged and I bought the gaskets,. seals and springs from a couple different places. If you do a search here you can see what I had done.
Bill
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Wed, Oct 13, 2010 6:51 AM
budtoh3zo
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Reply to Cysco:


D8PETE..... I was under the direction of several of the guys here diagnosing, disassembly and putting the parts back together.A local machine shop did the resurfacing of the contact areas that were damaged and I bought the gaskets,. seals and springs from a couple different places. If you do a search here you can see what I had done.
Bill
I got some time to play around with her, Removed the plunger found it to be washed out, It was plastic and the new one is metal with a rubbery oring. Changed the fuel filters, streched the spring alittle. threw her all back together and cranking with the pup i can just about max the fuel pressure gauget out now πŸ‘. Still had a rough start so pulled the valve cover and found 3 or the 4 intake valves were tight so reset them and will see tommrow how it starts.

Also found one issue i need to track down, one number 3 cylinder the push rod for the intake valve is not getting any oil were could it be plugged? All the other push rods are getting oil.
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Sun, Oct 31, 2010 10:35 AM
ol Grump
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Reply to budtoh3zo:
I got some time to play around with her, Removed the plunger found it to be washed out, It was plastic and the new one is metal with a rubbery oring. Changed the fuel filters, streched the spring alittle. threw her all back together and cranking with the pup i can just about max the fuel pressure gauget out now πŸ‘. Still had a rough start so pulled the valve cover and found 3 or the 4 intake valves were tight so reset them and will see tommrow how it starts.

Also found one issue i need to track down, one number 3 cylinder the push rod for the intake valve is not getting any oil were could it be plugged? All the other push rods are getting oil.
In colder weather you'll need to run the pony longer against compression in the main to build a bit of heat in the engine. I'd start the pony, release compression in the main and get it spinning over for a minute or so and then kick it into compression. Walk around it checking for leaks, grab the oil can and squirt a few drops into all the little oil cups, admire the cackling sound of the pony for a minute or so and then bump the throttle on the main. Usually by then, the middle of the head on the diesel would be about body temp and after the initial burst of black smoke, it would just sit there and rumble. Then, I'd turn off the gas to the pony, wait 'til it died and go finish my coffee. By that time the main would be warmed up enough to get going on the day.
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Sun, Oct 31, 2010 8:27 PM
ccjersey
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I believe you will have to take off the rocker shaft and wash out with kerosene etc. I had one like that on our 9U.

It's possible you could simply move the offending rocker arm to the side compressing the spring and try to flush out the oil port in the shaft.
D2-5J's, D6-9U's, D318 and D333 power units, 12E-99E grader, 922B & 944A wheel loaders, D330C generator set, DW20 water tanker and a bunch of Jersey cows to take care of in my spare timeπŸ˜„
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Sun, Oct 31, 2010 9:12 PM
budtoh3zo
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Reply to ccjersey:
I believe you will have to take off the rocker shaft and wash out with kerosene etc. I had one like that on our 9U.

It's possible you could simply move the offending rocker arm to the side compressing the spring and try to flush out the oil port in the shaft.
Thanks thats were i figgered the oil port was. Now to go and play with it.
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Sun, Oct 31, 2010 10:26 PM
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