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rpm's of cats operation.

rpm's of cats operation.

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eric in gilroy
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Was running my d4 in shop chaseing a air in line problem and a friend came over and was saying that it is hard on engine to run them at a slow idel. he said to run them at 1/4 speed instead of idel. according to him slow speed with no load pounds them to much and is not recomended. I also told him that I run my d2 at 3/4 rpm when pulling disc's because it so easy for it. and he said to run the d2 full throtte regraudless of load. Is any of this true?
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Thu, Nov 22, 2012 10:40 PM
ccjersey
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Don 't think so. Cat designed the engines with large bearing areas and high volume oil flow. If you read the discussion about the oil pressure gauge calibration, it takes very little oil pressure to maintain proper lubrication, less than 5psi as I remember. So, at low idle with no turbocharger, there is plenty of oil flow for the bearings.

Lugging an engine under load is usually frowned upon, but to me, again, that is a problem more with turbocharged engines. High fuel rate, lots of heat, less cooling air flow etc. Probably piston crowns and oil suffer the worst from those conditions.

There are probably engines which have bad crankshaft harmonics at certain rpm ranges, but CAT didn't use dampers until they were building high hp/high rpm engines. The old long stroke engines in machinery without torque converters use more of the rpm range than high speed turbocharged engines in front of a torque converter.

Most ag equipment these days has some sort of "field cruise " capability to save fuel under light loading conditions even though those engines are all high rpm turbocharged engines. All the same, they are not supposed to be lugged under heavy loads at part throttle.
D2-5J's, D6-9U's, D318 and D333 power units, 12E-99E grader, 922B & 944A wheel loaders, D330C generator set, DW20 water tanker and a bunch of Jersey cows to take care of in my spare time😄
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Fri, Nov 23, 2012 12:16 AM
Ray54
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I have never heard this before.Have heard many stories of Cat's that were hard to start or had bad pony motors that ran 24 hours a day,many of those hours at a slow idle to save fuel.The last such was a cousin in BC Canada was clearing brush with a older D7 and was told he had a job as long as the tractor would go that winter. So it ran for several mouths except for a quick oil change or two.There are other problems some time from to much idle time like wet stacking,but not bad for bearings.And of coarse are fine state has or at least proposed a law that equipment was not to idle more than 5 minutes.
Ray
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Fri, Nov 23, 2012 12:30 AM
eric in gilroy
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Reply to Ray54:
I have never heard this before.Have heard many stories of Cat's that were hard to start or had bad pony motors that ran 24 hours a day,many of those hours at a slow idle to save fuel.The last such was a cousin in BC Canada was clearing brush with a older D7 and was told he had a job as long as the tractor would go that winter. So it ran for several mouths except for a quick oil change or two.There are other problems some time from to much idle time like wet stacking,but not bad for bearings.And of coarse are fine state has or at least proposed a law that equipment was not to idle more than 5 minutes.
Ray
thanks guys it didnt sound right . I have a 1910 buick with a big 314ci four cylinder motor thats got a long stroke motor that i show off with it will idel so slow you can see the fan slow down and speed up with each power stroke . and have been do that for years with no problems. when i run my d2 pulling disc's there is no way it lugging cause the throtte is very responsive when i rev it.[attachment=15505]drivers side motor.jpg[/attachment][attachment=15506]exhaust.jpg[/attachment]
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Fri, Nov 23, 2012 1:06 AM
catsilver
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Reply to eric in gilroy:
thanks guys it didnt sound right . I have a 1910 buick with a big 314ci four cylinder motor thats got a long stroke motor that i show off with it will idel so slow you can see the fan slow down and speed up with each power stroke . and have been do that for years with no problems. when i run my d2 pulling disc's there is no way it lugging cause the throtte is very responsive when i rev it.[attachment=15505]drivers side motor.jpg[/attachment][attachment=15506]exhaust.jpg[/attachment]
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There is nothing wrong with running the old machines at low idle for a short time if you need to, but they were designed to work with the throttle wide open, the only limitation is not making them lug too much was, if the engine is working too hard at a lugged down speed and the temperature gauge goes up too high, work in the next gear down for any easier life and better fuel economy.
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Fri, Nov 23, 2012 4:42 AM
neil
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Reply to catsilver:
There is nothing wrong with running the old machines at low idle for a short time if you need to, but they were designed to work with the throttle wide open, the only limitation is not making them lug too much was, if the engine is working too hard at a lugged down speed and the temperature gauge goes up too high, work in the next gear down for any easier life and better fuel economy.
Here's my opinion for what it's worth. I operated between the torque peak and the horsepower peak. If the load did not require full torque, I still aimed to operate at the torque peak rpm because that's where I gained the best fuel economy. This was in 45 tonne logging trucks. Didn't make any difference between the 280hp 8V71 or the 550hp E9 or the 600hp KT19 - they all performed best for us that way and that was in the 1200 (torque peak) to 1900 rpm (hp peak) range.
However, those engines were well-loaded for their capacity (well, the Jimmy was a bit undersized...). If they drove around all day empty, they'd soon coke up too, and I'd be better off using a Superduty or Ram or something. The reason different size engines are built is so you can match them to the workload. To me, somewhere around a 75% load average is ideal - maximizes your return on investment.
Cheers,
Neil.
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Fri, Nov 23, 2012 9:55 AM
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