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Martyn Williams Any Tips On Welding This

Martyn Williams Any Tips On Welding This

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King of Obsolete
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i have seen you guys across the pond fix these before. what welding rod and do i preheat and cool down too???

thansk
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Thu, May 21, 2009 8:26 PM
MARTYN WILLIAMS
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Hello K of O
When I was a apprentice,we were given projects similar to this.One method was to drill peg the broken teeth then build up with cast rods,the peg method would give it strength, but you had to preheat the job to prevent fractures.Then when you have got the right profile,grind and file to finnish off.But these days there are a few companies ( but are getting less) within the UK that can make up new gears.A very good friend of mine, the late great Fred Dibnah had gears made up to a pattern for his Aveling Porter steam tractor.
I think it may be more cost effective to get a replacement made than a repair job.As its repair is only as good as the skills of the person that does it.
I have repaired,using cast rods small gears with success, but I think I would not be good enough to take on a bigger job.
Hope this helps
Martyn
If its just slight wear or a chip,I would give it a try with a cast rod.heat the gear,but not red hot.Try to find the composition of the gear.The gamble is if not done right,the repaired bit will break off causing more damage than you had in the first place.
Aveling Barford GA
D2 3j
D4 7j Dozer
btd6 Drott X 3
B100
I H TD6
Fordson major
Fordson N
Hydrovane 90
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Thu, May 21, 2009 8:52 PM
bobcatd311
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Reply to MARTYN WILLIAMS:
Hello K of O
When I was a apprentice,we were given projects similar to this.One method was to drill peg the broken teeth then build up with cast rods,the peg method would give it strength, but you had to preheat the job to prevent fractures.Then when you have got the right profile,grind and file to finnish off.But these days there are a few companies ( but are getting less) within the UK that can make up new gears.A very good friend of mine, the late great Fred Dibnah had gears made up to a pattern for his Aveling Porter steam tractor.
I think it may be more cost effective to get a replacement made than a repair job.As its repair is only as good as the skills of the person that does it.
I have repaired,using cast rods small gears with success, but I think I would not be good enough to take on a bigger job.
Hope this helps
Martyn
If its just slight wear or a chip,I would give it a try with a cast rod.heat the gear,but not red hot.Try to find the composition of the gear.The gamble is if not done right,the repaired bit will break off causing more damage than you had in the first place.
As long as we are on the topic of welding, i have a d2 5u pony that has freeze cracks on the bottom of the block (under the piston).

I have an arc welder and a mig welder. Not an expert but i am capable. Is this something i could attempt if so how (i e what rod, what settings, do i need to preheat or pin the cracks etc?)

There are some good welders here and i should probably have them do it but i am willing to risk the block if i can learn.

Bob
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Fri, May 22, 2009 12:02 AM
MARTYN WILLIAMS
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Reply to bobcatd311:
As long as we are on the topic of welding, i have a d2 5u pony that has freeze cracks on the bottom of the block (under the piston).

I have an arc welder and a mig welder. Not an expert but i am capable. Is this something i could attempt if so how (i e what rod, what settings, do i need to preheat or pin the cracks etc?)

There are some good welders here and i should probably have them do it but i am willing to risk the block if i can learn.

Bob
Hello Bob
Its a common problem on the pony engines.I patched mine about 5 years ago and its fine.To prevent this problem,use antifreeze or drain down system .To make sure,remove cylinder heads and flush out sedement.This will also help with cooling.
Martyn

Try it yourself,make sure that area to be welded is clean,warm up area with a blowlamp.Don't try to weld it in one go.Do a bit,stop then do a bit more.Don't rush the job.I used cast rods.
Aveling Barford GA
D2 3j
D4 7j Dozer
btd6 Drott X 3
B100
I H TD6
Fordson major
Fordson N
Hydrovane 90
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Fri, May 22, 2009 12:49 AM
gauntjoh
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Reply to MARTYN WILLIAMS:
Hello Bob
Its a common problem on the pony engines.I patched mine about 5 years ago and its fine.To prevent this problem,use antifreeze or drain down system .To make sure,remove cylinder heads and flush out sedement.This will also help with cooling.
Martyn

Try it yourself,make sure that area to be welded is clean,warm up area with a blowlamp.Don't try to weld it in one go.Do a bit,stop then do a bit more.Don't rush the job.I used cast rods.
Whilst I would not class myself as an expert welder, I have had some success on gear teeth using dissimilar metal electrodes with an Arc welder and pre-heat.
The rods I prefer are Inox DW (Oerlikon) and EutecTrode Xuper 680S (Eutectic).
As Martyn says, do a little at a time and allow to cool inbetween welds.
It goes without saying that you must have a clean and oil/grease free surface to deposit the weld onto.
I would imagine that with the right type of wire, MIG welding could be used as well, but I've no experience of this myself.
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Fri, May 22, 2009 1:43 AM
shovel man
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Reply to gauntjoh:
Whilst I would not class myself as an expert welder, I have had some success on gear teeth using dissimilar metal electrodes with an Arc welder and pre-heat.
The rods I prefer are Inox DW (Oerlikon) and EutecTrode Xuper 680S (Eutectic).
As Martyn says, do a little at a time and allow to cool inbetween welds.
It goes without saying that you must have a clean and oil/grease free surface to deposit the weld onto.
I would imagine that with the right type of wire, MIG welding could be used as well, but I've no experience of this myself.
I'm with Gauntjoh on this one (by the way it was good to meet you John at
the agm at Russel Saywell's), some years ago I built up a final drive pinion
on a Twenty Two using high tensile electrodes if I remember correctly,
most gears are either machined from blanks or cast steel, some old
implement gears are cast iron, the cast iron gears will be harder to repair
due to cooling of the weld and the quality of the cast!

as for repairing poney motor blocks I'd use nickel rods,
general rule is only weld 10x diameter of the rod, ie 2mm rod weld
length 20mm and peen the weld with a ball pain hammer as it cools
gently preheat the block before welding,

shovel man.
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Fri, May 22, 2009 3:37 AM
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