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hydraulic add-on to d69u

hydraulic add-on to d69u

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DDDfarmer
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Hi guys I have a question. I am wanting to pull some implements behind my D6 9U, yet there are no remotes for me to attach to. As far as I know there are no capabilities to add any extra hydraulic pumps or resevoirs, and the PTO is connected to a large carco winch that I am not wanting to remove. So I was thinking I have two options.

1, build a frame over the winch to support a gas engine/pump porta-pack lots of psi/flow but a second motor to contend with. There are systems out there that are self contained and would almost feel like I was on a regular farm tractor as far as the PSI/flow. these systems are 1k-2k and ready to run. Plus they could be used different places other times to replace using a tractor for a task.

2, re-vamp my 12 volt system and go with a 12 volt self contained pack. High voltage draw, lower flow/PSI but quiet and ready to go as long as I have power available. This would require I get the generator rebuilt, double the battery's. Yet this could be done under 1k. The main drawback is no quick response time on the hydraulics but would be simple to ger working also.

Anybody have any other ideas, comments or recomendations and which way they would set this up? If it wasnt for the self contained hydraulics on the d6 I could add a valve and remotes like on our TD6. I think I know which way I will go at this just would like to get other ideas.
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Thu, Mar 1, 2012 10:00 PM
Old Magnet
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The self contained hydraulics you mention....is that the front mounted #46 pump??? I recently learned that there is/was a rear supply option availabile (never seen one) that places two diverter valves controlled by a single lever in the #46 system. Uses two valves much like the D2/D4 diverter valves but plumbing is a bag of snakes, original application was for the #6 ripper and dozer.

Also in the day there was a #44 2-valve pump front mount option for the D6 that supplied hydraulics to the rear but not applicable to front mounted dozer.

Another option would be a belt drive hydraulic pump off the fan/waterpump belt. Late D6's actually changed to a double belt and tensioner but rarely ever see them either.

If none of the above I think I'd go with the separate engine drive you mention which would give you portability. What pressures/volumes are you wanting to run? Don't cut the hp to close.
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Thu, Mar 1, 2012 11:04 PM
DDDfarmer
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Reply to Old Magnet:
The self contained hydraulics you mention....is that the front mounted #46 pump??? I recently learned that there is/was a rear supply option availabile (never seen one) that places two diverter valves controlled by a single lever in the #46 system. Uses two valves much like the D2/D4 diverter valves but plumbing is a bag of snakes, original application was for the #6 ripper and dozer.

Also in the day there was a #44 2-valve pump front mount option for the D6 that supplied hydraulics to the rear but not applicable to front mounted dozer.

Another option would be a belt drive hydraulic pump off the fan/waterpump belt. Late D6's actually changed to a double belt and tensioner but rarely ever see them either.

If none of the above I think I'd go with the separate engine drive you mention which would give you portability. What pressures/volumes are you wanting to run? Don't cut the hp to close.
We are in the process of gathering/building a trailer ripper and would like to purchase a Kello-built heavy disc. not sure what weight the ripper will come in at but the dics are 6000-10000 lbs depending on the model.

The pump on my 6 is the #46 and have never seen any other ports on it. I was thinking the electric pump for the reason its one less motor to run and maintain. Electric packs I have seen are .9- 1.2 gpm and 2500-3200 PSI. But the gas pump I could remove and use in the back of the truck or remotely to run augers-what not. nothin is decided yet, 3-4 feet of snow around the d6 and its going to sit till more snow melts.
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Fri, Mar 2, 2012 12:45 AM
Old Magnet
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Reply to DDDfarmer:
We are in the process of gathering/building a trailer ripper and would like to purchase a Kello-built heavy disc. not sure what weight the ripper will come in at but the dics are 6000-10000 lbs depending on the model.

The pump on my 6 is the #46 and have never seen any other ports on it. I was thinking the electric pump for the reason its one less motor to run and maintain. Electric packs I have seen are .9- 1.2 gpm and 2500-3200 PSI. But the gas pump I could remove and use in the back of the truck or remotely to run augers-what not. nothin is decided yet, 3-4 feet of snow around the d6 and its going to sit till more snow melts.
There are no ports involved with the #46 rear hydraulics. It's all done by taping in with diverter valves and hoses. At 66-70 gpm capacity you'd need to be running pretty big cylinder/s.
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Fri, Mar 2, 2012 1:16 AM
DDDfarmer
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Reply to Old Magnet:
There are no ports involved with the #46 rear hydraulics. It's all done by taping in with diverter valves and hoses. At 66-70 gpm capacity you'd need to be running pretty big cylinder/s.
Wow... that looks busy. That could be done but what are the chances those parts are easy to find. Aftermarket could make that up but what would be the cost. Yet the #46 control unit would easily pick up the heavyest disc. Wow options. That would also require I replace the #10 oil in the hydraulics with Hy-tran. something to think about
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Fri, Mar 2, 2012 1:42 AM
ccjersey
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You might not be able to use the #46 unless you had the large diameter cylinders like OM mentioned. I'm not sure what the pressure setting on the 46 was, but the 44 and 41 were low, maybe 1000 psi. Most modern hydraulics are going to be over 2000 or even higher, so the cylinders will be sized for high pressure unless you change them out.

Any chance of using a block and the towing winch like a CCU to raise the ripper. I know our Rome offset disk had that option, but it was run with a double drum rear CCU.

You might also look at a 12 volt alternator conversion in place of the generator. There are some direct drive conversions available, but sometimes folks gut the existing 6V generator and use the housing and drive gear to mount an accessory shaft which is used to belt drive an alternator, and even AC compressors etc.
D2-5J's, D6-9U's, D318 and D333 power units, 12E-99E grader, 922B & 944A wheel loaders, D330C generator set, DW20 water tanker and a bunch of Jersey cows to take care of in my spare time😄
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Fri, Mar 2, 2012 8:26 AM
DDDfarmer
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Reply to ccjersey:
You might not be able to use the #46 unless you had the large diameter cylinders like OM mentioned. I'm not sure what the pressure setting on the 46 was, but the 44 and 41 were low, maybe 1000 psi. Most modern hydraulics are going to be over 2000 or even higher, so the cylinders will be sized for high pressure unless you change them out.

Any chance of using a block and the towing winch like a CCU to raise the ripper. I know our Rome offset disk had that option, but it was run with a double drum rear CCU.

You might also look at a 12 volt alternator conversion in place of the generator. There are some direct drive conversions available, but sometimes folks gut the existing 6V generator and use the housing and drive gear to mount an accessory shaft which is used to belt drive an alternator, and even AC compressors etc.
Our tractor hydraulics that I have tested are 2500-3200 PSI and all our cylinders have held up fine. If anything the cylinders on the 6 would not hold up to modern hydraulics and not vice-versa.

I had first planned on building the ripper with the winch as the lifting device. But I cannot run the winch on the fly, have to stop and engage the control. That is why I thought to run with hydraulics. Also if the implements are built with hydraulics our tractors could be used to move them around.

Thanks for the input.
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Fri, Mar 2, 2012 8:58 AM
Mike Walsh
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Reply to DDDfarmer:
Our tractor hydraulics that I have tested are 2500-3200 PSI and all our cylinders have held up fine. If anything the cylinders on the 6 would not hold up to modern hydraulics and not vice-versa.

I had first planned on building the ripper with the winch as the lifting device. But I cannot run the winch on the fly, have to stop and engage the control. That is why I thought to run with hydraulics. Also if the implements are built with hydraulics our tractors could be used to move them around.

Thanks for the input.
Here's another variation. How about using a diverter valve controlled by an electric solenoid to build a circuit to the rear.
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Fri, Mar 2, 2012 8:40 PM
Ray54
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Reply to Mike Walsh:
Here's another variation. How about using a diverter valve controlled by an electric solenoid to build a circuit to the rear.
Unless your 46 hydraulic unit is in excellent condition you will not be happy with the lifting power on modern ag equipment.I have the set up OM shows,and attempted to us it on ag equipment. The performance of the blade was not terrible with 46 unit I have( would lift the front of the tractor up)it really struggled to get a field cultivator out of the ground.Of coarse it did not help that the control valve had as much if not more ware than the pump did.Another thing these are high volume low pressure ware modern ag is high pressure low volume.
As I had many other used parts available I removed the Cat unit and used a Hydreco pump and control valve. A very clever friend built a joy stick control that is very sweet,since we also added a tilt cylinder to the blade.But after 20 years the Hydreco pump is now very tired as well.
Ray
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Fri, Mar 2, 2012 9:51 PM
Old Magnet
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Reply to Ray54:
Unless your 46 hydraulic unit is in excellent condition you will not be happy with the lifting power on modern ag equipment.I have the set up OM shows,and attempted to us it on ag equipment. The performance of the blade was not terrible with 46 unit I have( would lift the front of the tractor up)it really struggled to get a field cultivator out of the ground.Of coarse it did not help that the control valve had as much if not more ware than the pump did.Another thing these are high volume low pressure ware modern ag is high pressure low volume.
As I had many other used parts available I removed the Cat unit and used a Hydreco pump and control valve. A very clever friend built a joy stick control that is very sweet,since we also added a tilt cylinder to the blade.But after 20 years the Hydreco pump is now very tired as well.
Ray
Just as an example, the single cylinder used on the #6 ripper is a 7-1/4" bore. Even at the 1000 psi operating pressure of the #46 I don't think you'd have much difficulty with control.

Ray,
Be interesting to get more details on your alternate system, especially how you delt with the dozer requirements vs small volume usage.
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Fri, Mar 2, 2012 10:41 PM
ccjersey
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Reply to DDDfarmer:
Our tractor hydraulics that I have tested are 2500-3200 PSI and all our cylinders have held up fine. If anything the cylinders on the 6 would not hold up to modern hydraulics and not vice-versa.

I had first planned on building the ripper with the winch as the lifting device. But I cannot run the winch on the fly, have to stop and engage the control. That is why I thought to run with hydraulics. Also if the implements are built with hydraulics our tractors could be used to move them around.

Thanks for the input.
[quote="DDDfarmer"]Our tractor hydraulics that I have tested are 2500-3200 PSI and all our cylinders have held up fine. If anything the cylinders on the 6 would not hold up to modern hydraulics and not vice-versa.
Thanks for the input.[/quote]

You got that right.

Like Ray points out, your 46 control won't have enough pressure to lift most impliments that have cylinders sized for modern hydaulics. So you would have to design with multiple smaller cylinders or find some really large diameter ones somewhere.
D2-5J's, D6-9U's, D318 and D333 power units, 12E-99E grader, 922B & 944A wheel loaders, D330C generator set, DW20 water tanker and a bunch of Jersey cows to take care of in my spare time😄
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Sat, Mar 3, 2012 1:31 AM
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