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has anyone tried this?

has anyone tried this?

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tanker
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Has anyone tried using aluminum channel for wide light wt track pads? In an article dat featured rubber tracks on planter & graincart-[when rubber tracks first appeared]- in background the guy had a D5 with such pads- but don't know how it worked out- he farmed mississippi bottom ground in SE Ia & think I saw his whole farmstead wash down the river- on TV- in 93-& haven't seen anything since? Am Leary of trying on D8 cuz of wt..Anybody seen such a deal??:noidea:
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Tue, Nov 15, 2011 7:52 AM
zootownjeepguy
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You'll want some aluminum channel with a pretty thick wall. Aluminum will bend much easier than steel (comparing same size/wall thickness).
Rich Salvaggio
D2 5U9917
'46 Willys CJ2A Farm Jeep, '39 Buick sedan, '49 International KB-7, '37 Allis Chalmers WC, Cushman Scooter(s)
Antique garden tractors & outboard motors
Other rusty old junk comes & goes without warning.

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Tue, Nov 15, 2011 8:38 AM
Mike Walsh
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You're going to need a lot of aluminum frame rail for that project. You'll have to visit every truck wrecker within a 500 mile radius to collect enough material to make that many track pads.
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Tue, Nov 15, 2011 8:53 AM
tanker
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Reply to Mike Walsh:



You're going to need a lot of aluminum frame rail for that project. You'll have to visit every truck wrecker within a 500 mile radius to collect enough material to make that many track pads.
rounding up the al isn't much of my concern- going to the effort & finding out it's a loosing deal is what bothers me- would like to see if somebody has been der & done dat..[w/ success]theory is light wt pads = less Hp expended @ speed=better fuel economy- thinking bout running the 46A in road gear w field cult.. tank track is live & wants to go round sprokets- while cat is dead track & takes power to do same & speed compounds this.. wt of wide pads don't help either - but necessary so as not to smash my dirt..
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Tue, Nov 15, 2011 9:02 AM
tailseat15
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Reply to tanker:
rounding up the al isn't much of my concern- going to the effort & finding out it's a loosing deal is what bothers me- would like to see if somebody has been der & done dat..[w/ success]theory is light wt pads = less Hp expended @ speed=better fuel economy- thinking bout running the 46A in road gear w field cult.. tank track is live & wants to go round sprokets- while cat is dead track & takes power to do same & speed compounds this.. wt of wide pads don't help either - but necessary so as not to smash my dirt..
Would oak planks be practical? (no pun intended!) I've seen wood added on top of factory grousers to increase floatation, was fairly common around the Delta here in CA at one time. Might work if they are not too much longer than the steel pad underneath, and should be somewhat less expensive.
I'm not quite sure I follow what you're using the tracks on, with regards to the tank and round sprokets, is this on a pull implement or a tractor??? Just a thought.
Lots of guys used to run channel iron bolted onto the factory grousers to add floatation. Those worked well and lasted a long time usually. The best way I can describe it is if you're looking at the grouser on the tractor, on the top surface (the part that touches the ground) the channel iron would be placed with the open "C" side touching the grouser, and the flat side of the channel touched the ground. Often the ends were cut and bent down then re-welded to roll the ends down some.
The other thing I've seen done to get more floatation/traction besides using a lighter tractor (D6 or D7 size) is extending the track frames longer, adding one or two rollers and lengthening the track rails.
For sure I'm no engineer, but I just don't see lightening the tractor as a way to increase fuel economy on something like a Caterpillar D8. For it to run efficiently, it should be pulling at or around its max capacity without being overtaxed. This is a function also of traction and that is weight. If you lighten it up enough to increase fuel economy, it probably won't pull enough width of implement to be efficient and you'll burn more diesel per acre anyways. Best to match the width/depth of implement to the tractor HP to optimize the fuel/acre used. Probably the best results would be from re-powering the tractor with a modern diesel engine with more efficient fuel injection system, but then you'd be spending more than what the extra fuel would cost for quite a while!!!
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Tue, Nov 15, 2011 12:19 PM
tanker
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Reply to tailseat15:
Would oak planks be practical? (no pun intended!) I've seen wood added on top of factory grousers to increase floatation, was fairly common around the Delta here in CA at one time. Might work if they are not too much longer than the steel pad underneath, and should be somewhat less expensive.
I'm not quite sure I follow what you're using the tracks on, with regards to the tank and round sprokets, is this on a pull implement or a tractor??? Just a thought.
Lots of guys used to run channel iron bolted onto the factory grousers to add floatation. Those worked well and lasted a long time usually. The best way I can describe it is if you're looking at the grouser on the tractor, on the top surface (the part that touches the ground) the channel iron would be placed with the open "C" side touching the grouser, and the flat side of the channel touched the ground. Often the ends were cut and bent down then re-welded to roll the ends down some.
The other thing I've seen done to get more floatation/traction besides using a lighter tractor (D6 or D7 size) is extending the track frames longer, adding one or two rollers and lengthening the track rails.
For sure I'm no engineer, but I just don't see lightening the tractor as a way to increase fuel economy on something like a Caterpillar D8. For it to run efficiently, it should be pulling at or around its max capacity without being overtaxed. This is a function also of traction and that is weight. If you lighten it up enough to increase fuel economy, it probably won't pull enough width of implement to be efficient and you'll burn more diesel per acre anyways. Best to match the width/depth of implement to the tractor HP to optimize the fuel/acre used. Probably the best results would be from re-powering the tractor with a modern diesel engine with more efficient fuel injection system, but then you'd be spending more than what the extra fuel would cost for quite a while!!!
[quote="tailseat15"]
I'm not quite sure I follow what you're using the tracks on, with regards to the tank and round sprokets, is this on a pull implement or a tractor??? Just a thought.

For sure I'm no engineer, but I just don't see lightening the tractor as a way to increase fuel economy on something like a Caterpillar D8. For it to run efficiently, it should be pulling at or around its max capacity without being overtaxed. Best to match the width/depth of implement to the tractor HP to optimize the fuel/acre used. Probably the best results would be from re-powering the tractor with a modern diesel engine with more efficient fuel injection system, but then you'd be spending more than what the extra fuel would cost for quite a while!!![/quote]

Will try to splain---tank uses live track - if split it will roll up in ball = wants to go around the sprockets& idler -- while cat has dead track & requires effort to pull it around & back.. no big deal @ low speed- but as speed increases the HP required to just run the track gets out of hand- [I'v been in M60 tank 60mph- don't think dead steel track could hack that]- the deal is not lightning up the cat -- its trying to lighten up the track itself.........pulling cap is a a fallacy on the D8's or D7's w/ the 5 3/4 /8 low rpm eng-- my RD7's & 2U D8 use the same fuel on the same implement-[3 1/2 gal/ hr on old fuel & 4 gal/hr on new crap] they use what it takes to pull the load only- but kicking er up a gear takes a little more as the track starts to require more effort & imp is slapping dirt harder instead of being gentle bout it..---- dem new modern fuel efficient are really a joke- not a funny one either-- I had a 977 w one of those high and winders- 8 gal/ hr loading logs or plowing snow- [RD7 used bout 2 for same task]--my 2U D8 pulls the 10 bottom plow on 4 gal/hr @ 4mph & neighbors case IH pulls a 12 [10 was biggest I could find close]- no faster --but burns 35 gal/hr- give one of those new efficient ones NOT..😞----[shoes on 46A look a bit skimpy for farming]
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Tue, Nov 15, 2011 1:26 PM
zootownjeepguy
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Reply to tanker:
[quote="tailseat15"]
I'm not quite sure I follow what you're using the tracks on, with regards to the tank and round sprokets, is this on a pull implement or a tractor??? Just a thought.

For sure I'm no engineer, but I just don't see lightening the tractor as a way to increase fuel economy on something like a Caterpillar D8. For it to run efficiently, it should be pulling at or around its max capacity without being overtaxed. Best to match the width/depth of implement to the tractor HP to optimize the fuel/acre used. Probably the best results would be from re-powering the tractor with a modern diesel engine with more efficient fuel injection system, but then you'd be spending more than what the extra fuel would cost for quite a while!!![/quote]

Will try to splain---tank uses live track - if split it will roll up in ball = wants to go around the sprockets& idler -- while cat has dead track & requires effort to pull it around & back.. no big deal @ low speed- but as speed increases the HP required to just run the track gets out of hand- [I'v been in M60 tank 60mph- don't think dead steel track could hack that]- the deal is not lightning up the cat -- its trying to lighten up the track itself.........pulling cap is a a fallacy on the D8's or D7's w/ the 5 3/4 /8 low rpm eng-- my RD7's & 2U D8 use the same fuel on the same implement-[3 1/2 gal/ hr on old fuel & 4 gal/hr on new crap] they use what it takes to pull the load only- but kicking er up a gear takes a little more as the track starts to require more effort & imp is slapping dirt harder instead of being gentle bout it..---- dem new modern fuel efficient are really a joke- not a funny one either-- I had a 977 w one of those high and winders- 8 gal/ hr loading logs or plowing snow- [RD7 used bout 2 for same task]--my 2U D8 pulls the 10 bottom plow on 4 gal/hr @ 4mph & neighbors case IH pulls a 12 [10 was biggest I could find close]- no faster --but burns 35 gal/hr- give one of those new efficient ones NOT..😞----[shoes on 46A look a bit skimpy for farming]
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Tank tracks, or High Speed tracks have smaller links, shorter pitches and are much more flexible. They are also much more complex (more parts per link) and require more maintenance. After dozer tracks have "broken in" they flex more easily so it doesn't take away as many horsies to drive them.
Rich Salvaggio
D2 5U9917
'46 Willys CJ2A Farm Jeep, '39 Buick sedan, '49 International KB-7, '37 Allis Chalmers WC, Cushman Scooter(s)
Antique garden tractors & outboard motors
Other rusty old junk comes & goes without warning.

The 2 most useful tools to have in your shop are a Crystal Ball and a Magic Wand
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Wed, Nov 16, 2011 5:36 AM
Old 3T lover
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Reply to zootownjeepguy:
Tank tracks, or High Speed tracks have smaller links, shorter pitches and are much more flexible. They are also much more complex (more parts per link) and require more maintenance. After dozer tracks have "broken in" they flex more easily so it doesn't take away as many horsies to drive them.
Not only do I believe the aluminum will bend but I don't think the "cleat" part will last very long.

Aluminum isn't very "wear resistant".
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Wed, Nov 16, 2011 5:59 AM
cojhl2
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Reply to tanker:
[quote="tailseat15"]
I'm not quite sure I follow what you're using the tracks on, with regards to the tank and round sprokets, is this on a pull implement or a tractor??? Just a thought.

For sure I'm no engineer, but I just don't see lightening the tractor as a way to increase fuel economy on something like a Caterpillar D8. For it to run efficiently, it should be pulling at or around its max capacity without being overtaxed. Best to match the width/depth of implement to the tractor HP to optimize the fuel/acre used. Probably the best results would be from re-powering the tractor with a modern diesel engine with more efficient fuel injection system, but then you'd be spending more than what the extra fuel would cost for quite a while!!![/quote]

Will try to splain---tank uses live track - if split it will roll up in ball = wants to go around the sprockets& idler -- while cat has dead track & requires effort to pull it around & back.. no big deal @ low speed- but as speed increases the HP required to just run the track gets out of hand- [I'v been in M60 tank 60mph- don't think dead steel track could hack that]- the deal is not lightning up the cat -- its trying to lighten up the track itself.........pulling cap is a a fallacy on the D8's or D7's w/ the 5 3/4 /8 low rpm eng-- my RD7's & 2U D8 use the same fuel on the same implement-[3 1/2 gal/ hr on old fuel & 4 gal/hr on new crap] they use what it takes to pull the load only- but kicking er up a gear takes a little more as the track starts to require more effort & imp is slapping dirt harder instead of being gentle bout it..---- dem new modern fuel efficient are really a joke- not a funny one either-- I had a 977 w one of those high and winders- 8 gal/ hr loading logs or plowing snow- [RD7 used bout 2 for same task]--my 2U D8 pulls the 10 bottom plow on 4 gal/hr @ 4mph & neighbors case IH pulls a 12 [10 was biggest I could find close]- no faster --but burns 35 gal/hr- give one of those new efficient ones NOT..😞----[shoes on 46A look a bit skimpy for farming]
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Hmmm,, what is live vs dead track?

Also remember the work it takes to roll the track up around the sprocket is given back as the track goes down around the idler. From the standpoint of gravity9weight) there is no loss in the system.
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Wed, Nov 16, 2011 6:21 AM
catsilver
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Reply to cojhl2:


Hmmm,, what is live vs dead track?

Also remember the work it takes to roll the track up around the sprocket is given back as the track goes down around the idler. From the standpoint of gravity9weight) there is no loss in the system.
Many years ago we built a special extreme low ground pressure D5 (the D6C was too heavy), extra long sprocket shafts, extended track frames and rigid extended equalizer, and cast aluminium 2 metre track pads for a pipeline job across a swamp in Siberia. We managed to break some pads just driving over a couple of stones outside the workshop. The machines were converted back to standard and the job was done in winter when the ground was frozen!!
Don't bother with aluminium, use an LGP D5 machine with the narowest pads you can get away with , forget the tank tracks, they are not LGP, Vickers tried them in the 1950's and where are they today?
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Wed, Nov 16, 2011 6:44 AM
tanker
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Reply to zootownjeepguy:
Tank tracks, or High Speed tracks have smaller links, shorter pitches and are much more flexible. They are also much more complex (more parts per link) and require more maintenance. After dozer tracks have "broken in" they flex more easily so it doesn't take away as many horsies to drive them.
[QUOTE=zootownjeepguy;82878]Tank tracks, or High Speed tracks have smaller links, shorter pitches and are much more flexible. They are also much more complex (more parts per link) and require more maintenance.

Dat isn't how it goes each pad has a center guide dat keeps the track positioned sideways betwitx the road wheels- the links are connected to each other w/ end connectors- which slip over the cross pins on each end of individual pad- which are set in rubber-the pins have a flat so when the end connectors [ which happen to be what the drive sprockets drive on] are bolted in place w wedge it gives each an angle instead of being flt [ don't member what angle was]= wants to go round idler instead of requiring power to move it from straight line to going round idler-[113 used hex bar to connect pads to same effect]- when sprockets & end connectors get worn- it is a simple unbolt & bolt up replacement pts - no pushing pins & bushings..
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Wed, Nov 16, 2011 8:29 AM
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