ACMOC
Login
ACMOC
Finding and reading serial numbers and Troubleshooting starting Caterpillar TEN

Finding and reading serial numbers and Troubleshooting starting Caterpillar TEN

Showing 1 to 10 of 14 results
1
louislindsey72
Topic Author
Offline
Send a private message to louislindsey72
Posts: 25
Thank you received: 0
Hi I am restoring a Caterpillar TEN for our local county fair through the JB Dewar Tractor Restoration program, the tractor belonged to my grandfather and my great grandfather... My grandfather died a few weeks ago and left me his tractor to restore in the family name. I know the entire history of this specific tractor (Where it's been, what it was used for, who owned it, etc) but I don't know much about the Model TEN itself. I know the tractor has been repainted (old Caterpillar yellow) and I chipped a little paint off the "CATERPILLAR" on the front of the radiator, and underneath the yellow paint was red. I know that the original crawlers were grey with red letters, but i am not sure when they switched over to yellow.The tractor has the original brass plates with serial numbers, however I have no clue how to figure the tractors year by it's serial number, and I'm not sure if you can tell the year by serial numbers on the block either. If anyone knows how to tell the year of this tractor and happens to know some history and info on it as well that would be great.

Also the tractor is supposedly gas, but there are two separate valves on the tank that lead to the top of the same "filter" or "fuel bowl" (it's cast iron fuel bowl looking thing that connects straight to the carburetor). I am pretty stumped on why it has two valves, but i sure there's a logical explanation. The fuel bowl looking thing cracked and broke when I disconnected the fuel lines. I'd post pictures, but I'm new to this and I have no clue how to.

Right now the tractor has new spark plugs, and spark plug wires. I have checked the carburetor, it is clean and I have gone through the magneto (it's a Wico XH). The tractor still won't start. it is only hand-crank and when you turn it sometimes it feels stuck and hard to turn and other times it feels very loose and easy to turn. You can be in the middle of turning it and it suddenly feels very stiff. Anyways the tractor never starts to pop and go, it just blows blue-like smoke and pops like a shotgun blast. I have gone through the magneto several times (because it originally wasn't getting spark) so there is a chance that I may have thrown off the timing. I am pretty sure that problem is the timing. Does anyone have any directions on how to set the timing?
Please log in or create an account to join the conversation.
Sat, Dec 28, 2013 9:33 AM
mudgecko
Offline
Send a private message to mudgecko
Posts: 77
Thank you received: 0
louislindsey72 ,
With the ser# Pt 1- Pt7 in 1928 Pt 8 - Pt 3173 in 1928 Pt 3174 - Pt 4606 in 1930 Pt 4607 - Pt 4751 in 1931

Pt 4752 - Pt 4929 in 1932 Pt 4930-Pt 4932 in 1932

Gilbert
Please log in or create an account to join the conversation.
Sat, Dec 28, 2013 9:57 AM
gary ca
Offline
Member
Send a private message to gary ca
Posts: 206
Thank you received: 0
Welcome to the BB. There are dozens of people here that can help you start that 10. I am most familiar with the 15 but I think the timing procedure is smiliar.

The firing order is 1342. Check that first. You need to take the valve cover off and watch the valves on number one cylinder, the one closest to the fan. Try and find the approximateTop Dead Center for number 1 by watching the intake rise and then fall, crank a few more degrees and look for the timing mark on the crank pulley. There should be two lines about 25 degrees apart. The second one is Top Dead center for number one but only if the intake on number one has recently closed. The first one is where the timing should run once the engine is started and running. This can be checked with a car battery from another source and a timing light.

Adjust the mag so that it fires on number one as you crank the engine right at the second line. This will put the timing close.

See if this helps. There are a variety of other things to check such as compression. I posted a thread on the lack of compression about 2 days ago and got some good responses.

Keep us posted and we will get that 10 started. Gary
Please log in or create an account to join the conversation.
Sat, Dec 28, 2013 10:21 AM
Paso Bob
Offline
Send a private message to Paso Bob
Posts: 711
Thank you received: 0
Reply to gary ca:
Welcome to the BB. There are dozens of people here that can help you start that 10. I am most familiar with the 15 but I think the timing procedure is smiliar.

The firing order is 1342. Check that first. You need to take the valve cover off and watch the valves on number one cylinder, the one closest to the fan. Try and find the approximateTop Dead Center for number 1 by watching the intake rise and then fall, crank a few more degrees and look for the timing mark on the crank pulley. There should be two lines about 25 degrees apart. The second one is Top Dead center for number one but only if the intake on number one has recently closed. The first one is where the timing should run once the engine is started and running. This can be checked with a car battery from another source and a timing light.

Adjust the mag so that it fires on number one as you crank the engine right at the second line. This will put the timing close.

See if this helps. There are a variety of other things to check such as compression. I posted a thread on the lack of compression about 2 days ago and got some good responses.

Keep us posted and we will get that 10 started. Gary
I am not familiar with Cat gasoline engines, however an easy way to find top dead center for cylinder number one is pull the spark plugs and have some one crank the engine. Put your finger over number one hole and when the compression stroke comes up, it will put pressure on your finger. Set your magneto accordingly.
D-4 7U-43159 with 4S dozer and Cat 40 scraper, D-7 3T-1179 with Cat 7S hydraulic dozer, D-7 17A 13,944, D-8 14A-1160 with Cat 8S cable dozer, Cat 12-99E-4433 Grader. All runners and users.
Please log in or create an account to join the conversation.
Sat, Dec 28, 2013 11:11 AM
MARCOTEN
Offline
Send a private message to MARCOTEN
Posts: 530
Thank you received: 0
Reply to Paso Bob:
I am not familiar with Cat gasoline engines, however an easy way to find top dead center for cylinder number one is pull the spark plugs and have some one crank the engine. Put your finger over number one hole and when the compression stroke comes up, it will put pressure on your finger. Set your magneto accordingly.
cat highway yellow came in 1931

like mudgecko
stated, but it is :
With the ser# Pt 1- Pt7 in 1928 Pt 8 - Pt 3173 in 1929 this is the year the most TEN were produced so it iss probably from this year, you have the serial nr on the brass plates so can check ( serial. nr. is stamped also in engine on lefthand side on squere piece between carb and waterpump, and on transmision on lefthand side a bit behind left steering clutch handle)

the 2 seperate valves is for going up hill or down hill so Always fuel can reach carb.( engine has 2 oilpumps also for this up/down hill story btw.)

and pops like a shotgun blast: this sounds like there is a exhaust valve still open and not good closed( i have had same exp. with a fifteen but that was because of the valve clearance was out of adjustment), for this problem look at the post from Gary ca. about his fifteen.
about the timing i try to post a picture out of the instruction book of the TEN wich i realy recomend for you to buy, i have an old Original book but there are new copies available ( there is on ebay now:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Caterpillar-TEN-FIFTEEN-TWENTY-Operator-s-Instructions-/370685157035?pt=BI_Books_Manuals&hash=item564e8e9eab
and new ones are available from Jensales and is a must!)

about the 2 timing marks on the flywheel pulley: 1 is indeed for the timing mark at that point on the compression stroke for cil 1, at that mark the magneto points should just open and corresponding sparkplugwire should be conected with cil no.1 sparkplug,
so adjust that, and the 2nd mark is for top dead centre of cil 1&4.

so first get the valves all lose as stated in other post of Gary, check/adjust timing and then poor some gas (1 tablespoon) in each priming cup on intake manifold, magneto kill switch on dasboard in the on position offcourse and give it a crank!!! ( if those engines wont start it is my experiance that it is then lack of fuel so adjust carb)
offcourse we are interested in pictures so if you scroll down there is a upload pictures icon, click on it, there a are older post about picture uploading and also a search function so type any thing you look for and it will come up

[attachment=21019]scannen0005.jpg[/attachment]
Attachment
Please log in or create an account to join the conversation.
Sat, Dec 28, 2013 4:50 PM
rmyram
Offline
Send a private message to rmyram
Posts: 598
Thank you received: 0
since it is not running, and it is fireing through the exhaust like a shotgun, your timing is late, this can be either from the actual mag timing which is most likely, or your points could be hanging up and closing late causing late spark, (very rare, but I have this issue on my pony mag). Another possibility is that the firing order on your plugs is incorrect or you have gone around the distributor backwards with your wires. which could explain it feeling like it locks up halfway through a rotation on some and not on other cyls.

remember, you only need three things to make an Internal combustion spark ignition engine to run, Fuel and air and spark on time.
Please log in or create an account to join the conversation.
Sun, Dec 29, 2013 11:34 PM
MARCOTEN
Offline
Send a private message to MARCOTEN
Posts: 530
Thank you received: 0
Reply to rmyram:
since it is not running, and it is fireing through the exhaust like a shotgun, your timing is late, this can be either from the actual mag timing which is most likely, or your points could be hanging up and closing late causing late spark, (very rare, but I have this issue on my pony mag). Another possibility is that the firing order on your plugs is incorrect or you have gone around the distributor backwards with your wires. which could explain it feeling like it locks up halfway through a rotation on some and not on other cyls.

remember, you only need three things to make an Internal combustion spark ignition engine to run, Fuel and air and spark on time.
it can be that only one cilinder has good closing valves , that the other 3 dont have that so you feel this, measuring the compression would be handy.
Please log in or create an account to join the conversation.
Sun, Dec 29, 2013 11:48 PM
louislindsey72
Topic Author
Offline
Send a private message to louislindsey72
Posts: 25
Thank you received: 0
Reply to MARCOTEN:
it can be that only one cilinder has good closing valves , that the other 3 dont have that so you feel this, measuring the compression would be handy.
Thanks for all the great advice I was able to get the tractor running it fires up when you turn it over a quarter turn and Adjusted the carb so it runs fine. But when I went to put it in gear I wasn't able to engage the clutch. It seems like the clutch petal is frozen or locked up maybe? I'm not sure, does anyone know how to adjust the clutch pedals or fix this? I kind of have the idea that the pedal isn't pushing the levers far enough to engage the clutch but i'm not sure. (Still figuring out the picture uploading I have a Mac and the pic uploader doesn't let me upload pictures)
Please log in or create an account to join the conversation.
Wed, Jan 1, 2014 1:53 AM
MARCOTEN
Offline
Send a private message to MARCOTEN
Posts: 530
Thank you received: 0
Reply to louislindsey72:
Thanks for all the great advice I was able to get the tractor running it fires up when you turn it over a quarter turn and Adjusted the carb so it runs fine. But when I went to put it in gear I wasn't able to engage the clutch. It seems like the clutch petal is frozen or locked up maybe? I'm not sure, does anyone know how to adjust the clutch pedals or fix this? I kind of have the idea that the pedal isn't pushing the levers far enough to engage the clutch but i'm not sure. (Still figuring out the picture uploading I have a Mac and the pic uploader doesn't let me upload pictures)
the clutch pedal is adjustable, just on the underside of it, and mabe you have to adjust the clutch brake ( in side the clutch housing, open the square piece in front of driver with the oiling cup on it)
so if you hear the gears make noise when you want to shift , then From there you can losen the clutch brake , and find another hole to put the bolds back in and in a way that if you push the clutch , on the end of the stroke the brake is aplied.
you can open it and see inside with a torchlamp to look if everything working well.
The transmission have strait gears and no sinchromeshes, so only change gears when standing still.
Please log in or create an account to join the conversation.
Wed, Jan 1, 2014 3:17 AM
louislindsey72
Topic Author
Offline
Send a private message to louislindsey72
Posts: 25
Thank you received: 0
Reply to MARCOTEN:
the clutch pedal is adjustable, just on the underside of it, and mabe you have to adjust the clutch brake ( in side the clutch housing, open the square piece in front of driver with the oiling cup on it)
so if you hear the gears make noise when you want to shift , then From there you can losen the clutch brake , and find another hole to put the bolds back in and in a way that if you push the clutch , on the end of the stroke the brake is aplied.
you can open it and see inside with a torchlamp to look if everything working well.
The transmission have strait gears and no sinchromeshes, so only change gears when standing still.
So I looked into it more and the problem seems to be that the throw out bearing is stuck in place. Ive tried penetrating oil (of all kinds) and I've tried loosening it by force, but i have had no luck at all... does this mean I need to separate the engine and transmission to get into the housing and free it by hand? At this point I am thinking know that I know it runs fine I might as well start tearing into it anyway to start the actual restoration process.
Please log in or create an account to join the conversation.
Wed, Jan 1, 2014 11:50 AM
MARCOTEN
Offline
Send a private message to MARCOTEN
Posts: 530
Thank you received: 0
Reply to louislindsey72:
So I looked into it more and the problem seems to be that the throw out bearing is stuck in place. Ive tried penetrating oil (of all kinds) and I've tried loosening it by force, but i have had no luck at all... does this mean I need to separate the engine and transmission to get into the housing and free it by hand? At this point I am thinking know that I know it runs fine I might as well start tearing into it anyway to start the actual restoration process.
its quit a lot work splitting the engine, but if the bearing is stuck and you can not shift in to gears you can not drive it , so its taking away the leaf spring , blocking up engine, undo all bolts and then you can pull away the rear end of the tractor, this in a few words but much work.
Please log in or create an account to join the conversation.
Wed, Jan 1, 2014 6:39 PM
Showing 1 to 10 of 14 results
1
YouTube Video Placeholder

Follow Us on Social Media

Our channel highlights machines from the earliest Holt and Best track-type tractors, equipment from the start of Caterpillar in 1925, up to units built in the mid-1960s.

Upcoming Events

Lake Goldsmith Steam and Vintage Rally

Chapter Nineteen

| 1234 Carngham-Lake Goldsmith Rd, Lake Goldsmith, Victoria, 3373, Australia

Stradsett Park Vintage Rally

Chapter Two

| Stradsett, Nr Downham Market. Norfolk PE33 9HA UK

Chapter 2 The Link Club's AGM

Chapter Two

| Faulkner Farm, West Drove, Wisbech, Cambridgeshire, PE14 7DP, UK

HAMILTON PASTURAL MUSEUM

Chapter Nineteen

| Cnr Hiller Lane and Ballarat Road, Hamilton, Vic, 3300
View Calendar
ACMOC

Antique Caterpillar
Machinery Owners Club

1115 Madison St NE # 1117
Salem, OR 97301

[email protected]

Terms & Privacy
Website developed by AdCo

Testimonials

"I also joined a year ago. had been on here a couple of times as a non-member and found the info very helpful so I got a one year subscription (not very expensive at all) to try it out. I really like all the resources on here so I just got a three year. I think its a very small price for what you can get out of this site."
-Jason N

Join Today!