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D7 track removal?

D7 track removal?

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chief
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I am new to the site. We operate a ranch for disabled vets in NW Montana in an area called the Yaak. Recently acquired a D7, sorry don't know which model. Discovered that the right front (view from seat) forward idler housing has one of four bolts broken, a second that is partially out both inboard side of idler and the two on the outboard side appear okay. Tried to undo one that is partially out but won't budge. Assume would need to remove front idler and extract broken bolts so have to pull track apart. Never done that before; I see many do it by hand but also hear hydraulic press possible. Can anyone give advice? Thank you in advance.
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Sat, May 27, 2017 9:22 PM
rmyram
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drive the unit up on some blocks on the other side to get the track frame to oscillate, then get a welder and weld the broken bolt out of the idler yoke. you can heat the yoke where the bolt is. the loose bolt should come out with some pursuasion.

you shouldn't need to split the track to do this.
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Sat, May 27, 2017 10:17 PM
d2gary
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Reply to rmyram:
drive the unit up on some blocks on the other side to get the track frame to oscillate, then get a welder and weld the broken bolt out of the idler yoke. you can heat the yoke where the bolt is. the loose bolt should come out with some pursuasion.

you shouldn't need to split the track to do this.
I've had really good luck welding a nut on the broken bolt and then just unscrewing it. The heat from the welding seems to break it loose. Lots of wd40 or similar while it's hot will draw the juice down into the threads. If this doesn't work you can always go to the more aggressive cutting merhods.
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Sat, May 27, 2017 10:32 PM
chief
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Reply to d2gary:
I've had really good luck welding a nut on the broken bolt and then just unscrewing it. The heat from the welding seems to break it loose. Lots of wd40 or similar while it's hot will draw the juice down into the threads. If this doesn't work you can always go to the more aggressive cutting merhods.
I failed to mention that it appears the broken bolt broke off inside the idler so I don't think I can get a nut on it. But I really like the idea of not breaking the track apart. I know no one would in good conscious would run with just three bolts but need to get some trees down with roots out so wonder about just getting the one I can fixed for now and go with the three good ones?

Thank you for the advice d2gary and rmyram. rmyram; Can you expand on why putting the opposite track up on blocks aids in bolt removal, scratching my head over that but have no doubt there is a sound reason?
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Sun, May 28, 2017 7:34 PM
rmyram
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oscilates the track frames and gives you more head room by lifting the engine out of the way.

you can use 7018 wedling rod and weld to the broken bolt in the casting, then just kepp welding it until it is out the back of the hole, then weld a nut on.

you could do it with mig welder as well, just hold the wire in the centre of the hole and it wont stick to the cast yoke.
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Sun, May 28, 2017 10:52 PM
bobby1
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Reply to rmyram:
oscilates the track frames and gives you more head room by lifting the engine out of the way.

you can use 7018 wedling rod and weld to the broken bolt in the casting, then just kepp welding it until it is out the back of the hole, then weld a nut on.

you could do it with mig welder as well, just hold the wire in the centre of the hole and it wont stick to the cast yoke.
I am honestly not sure if which bolts you are referring but what rymram is talking about is building up some weld on the top of the broken bolt. stacked up welds.

I just figured I would share my experience in removing broken bolts, because I got very good at it. Our excavator needed several lower track rollers. 4 bolts per roller, and most of them snapped, and about flush with the frame. Our procedure was to weld a a very thick, beefy washer to the broken bolt, then weld a nut to the washer, then clobber the new nut with a sledge, and they ALL walked right out.


Things to be careful of.
1. Do not weld your female threads or you won't be turning anything. We used thick washers because we could better control the isolation of the welds.
2. Ensure your welder can throw down enough power to get real penetration.
3. clean before you weld! Now if you stick weld, that stuff is amazing at welding crap, but you gotta make sure you get a good bond.
4. Smack before you turn! Smacking the bolt works! I use this on everything, even before shit breaks!! The threads try to rust (bond) together, requiring WAY too much torque to turn. The smack breaks this bond and it will work even on tightened bolts.


If you wanna go a step further as you really need a bolt out, don't care about the bolt, and have help. Have one man on a wrench applying reasonable torque but not insane. Have another man with a flat punch and sledge smacking the bolt head. This trick has saved my life on some very long bolts.


I only bring this up because I have learned over the years that preparing for battle is half the fight. The time to do this is when you know a bolt has been in for decades and BEFORE you break it and go dragging a welder over. You MUST free the threads before you twist on them.
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Mon, May 29, 2017 12:07 AM
gemdozer
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Reply to bobby1:
I am honestly not sure if which bolts you are referring but what rymram is talking about is building up some weld on the top of the broken bolt. stacked up welds.

I just figured I would share my experience in removing broken bolts, because I got very good at it. Our excavator needed several lower track rollers. 4 bolts per roller, and most of them snapped, and about flush with the frame. Our procedure was to weld a a very thick, beefy washer to the broken bolt, then weld a nut to the washer, then clobber the new nut with a sledge, and they ALL walked right out.


Things to be careful of.
1. Do not weld your female threads or you won't be turning anything. We used thick washers because we could better control the isolation of the welds.
2. Ensure your welder can throw down enough power to get real penetration.
3. clean before you weld! Now if you stick weld, that stuff is amazing at welding crap, but you gotta make sure you get a good bond.
4. Smack before you turn! Smacking the bolt works! I use this on everything, even before shit breaks!! The threads try to rust (bond) together, requiring WAY too much torque to turn. The smack breaks this bond and it will work even on tightened bolts.


If you wanna go a step further as you really need a bolt out, don't care about the bolt, and have help. Have one man on a wrench applying reasonable torque but not insane. Have another man with a flat punch and sledge smacking the bolt head. This trick has saved my life on some very long bolts.


I only bring this up because I have learned over the years that preparing for battle is half the fight. The time to do this is when you know a bolt has been in for decades and BEFORE you break it and go dragging a welder over. You MUST free the threads before you twist on them.
You have to removed the idler side plate adjustement and removed the bolts from inner arm from rear idler if your bolts are the one in the bearing block and if it is the side plate bolts 5/8 are bolted to the collar
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Mon, May 29, 2017 5:42 AM
Ray54
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Reply to bobby1:
I am honestly not sure if which bolts you are referring but what rymram is talking about is building up some weld on the top of the broken bolt. stacked up welds.

I just figured I would share my experience in removing broken bolts, because I got very good at it. Our excavator needed several lower track rollers. 4 bolts per roller, and most of them snapped, and about flush with the frame. Our procedure was to weld a a very thick, beefy washer to the broken bolt, then weld a nut to the washer, then clobber the new nut with a sledge, and they ALL walked right out.


Things to be careful of.
1. Do not weld your female threads or you won't be turning anything. We used thick washers because we could better control the isolation of the welds.
2. Ensure your welder can throw down enough power to get real penetration.
3. clean before you weld! Now if you stick weld, that stuff is amazing at welding crap, but you gotta make sure you get a good bond.
4. Smack before you turn! Smacking the bolt works! I use this on everything, even before shit breaks!! The threads try to rust (bond) together, requiring WAY too much torque to turn. The smack breaks this bond and it will work even on tightened bolts.


If you wanna go a step further as you really need a bolt out, don't care about the bolt, and have help. Have one man on a wrench applying reasonable torque but not insane. Have another man with a flat punch and sledge smacking the bolt head. This trick has saved my life on some very long bolts.


I only bring this up because I have learned over the years that preparing for battle is half the fight. The time to do this is when you know a bolt has been in for decades and BEFORE you break it and go dragging a welder over. You MUST free the threads before you twist on them.
If you weld it up and the weld breaks,don't give up just clean up and weld it again. I have had to weld some several times but always had them come out if I kept trying.
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Mon, May 29, 2017 5:45 AM
gemdozer
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Reply to Ray54:
If you weld it up and the weld breaks,don't give up just clean up and weld it again. I have had to weld some several times but always had them come out if I kept trying.
Don't forget to removed the tension on the track when you work on your idler and your d7 serie number is stamp on side motor near the starting engine transmission and on the rear stering cluch housing up left side
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Mon, May 29, 2017 4:44 PM
chief
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Reply to gemdozer:
Don't forget to removed the tension on the track when you work on your idler and your d7 serie number is stamp on side motor near the starting engine transmission and on the rear stering cluch housing up left side
Wow, thanks you guys; you are an amazing volume of knowledge and hard earned wisdom. I'll get started on this in a few days and let you all know how well an idiot does at following instructions.👋
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Tue, May 30, 2017 4:36 AM
bluox
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Reply to chief:
Wow, thanks you guys; you are an amazing volume of knowledge and hard earned wisdom. I'll get started on this in a few days and let you all know how well an idiot does at following instructions.👋
Really need serial number but my wag, if your talking about the bolts that hold the slide plates on the idler yoke they have nuts or nut bars on them.You can take the top or bottom bolt out next to the broken one then punch it in toward the idler and cut the nut off . You may have to run that track up on a short block to take pressure on the idler.

Good luck
Bob
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Tue, May 30, 2017 7:21 AM
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