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D7 Pony question

D7 Pony question

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Raeme
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Hi all. I have an interesting problem. Initially I thought I had locked up the pony. It was lower on oil then I thought, but was pretty sure it still had a reasonable quantity still in it. Last week I started the big engine and the pony was still running. I turned off the pony like I always do, I went to the dozer yesterday to move it, when I put the handle on the pony it was rock solid no movement at all. I removed the clutch cover on the pony and barred it over. The motor moved straight away with no perceived " release" of a pinched engine. It is very tight and heavy to turn. I can now turn with the handle but it is loaded up. Before I started it last week I adjusted the clutch, so I backed off the clutch thinking maybe it had bound up. With the big engine clutch in, in gear and the pinion lever locked in I started to un adjust the clutch. When I'm turning the pony clutch the main engine fan is trying to turn. So is it possible to have the clutch plate frozen to the shaft and making it hard to start the pony due to drag? I also removed the pony inspection plates and there is no evidence of a seized engine, the interior of the engine still is wet with oil and there is no smell of burnt engine or evidence of lubrication loss. Obviously I have topped up pony oil as well.
Look forward to your thoughts, cheers.
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Sun, Jun 26, 2016 10:54 AM
edb
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Hi Raeme,
you should be able to manually de-latch the pony pinion latches by pushing on the adjustment ends of the latch pawls.
It takes a fairly sharp push to get them to de-latch.
This will stop the pony trying to drive the D/engine.
There should be a little cover in the D/E flywheel housing to do just this as well as adjust the latch throw out RPM.
Toby's tutorial on Pony pinions should help out here.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lKI3wTZU4AA

Toby has others up on the same subject that are well worth the time to watch.
Hope this helps.
Cheers,
Eddie B.
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Sun, Jun 26, 2016 11:32 AM
STEPHEN
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Reply to edb:
Hi Raeme,
you should be able to manually de-latch the pony pinion latches by pushing on the adjustment ends of the latch pawls.
It takes a fairly sharp push to get them to de-latch.
This will stop the pony trying to drive the D/engine.
There should be a little cover in the D/E flywheel housing to do just this as well as adjust the latch throw out RPM.
Toby's tutorial on Pony pinions should help out here.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lKI3wTZU4AA

Toby has others up on the same subject that are well worth the time to watch.
Hope this helps.
Cheers,
Eddie B.
So the last time you started the main engine, I guess the pinion didn't release? It must be malfunctioning, might need to be cleaned up, and checked well for correct operation.
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Sun, Jun 26, 2016 11:43 AM
Raeme
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Reply to edb:
Hi Raeme,
you should be able to manually de-latch the pony pinion latches by pushing on the adjustment ends of the latch pawls.
It takes a fairly sharp push to get them to de-latch.
This will stop the pony trying to drive the D/engine.
There should be a little cover in the D/E flywheel housing to do just this as well as adjust the latch throw out RPM.
Toby's tutorial on Pony pinions should help out here.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lKI3wTZU4AA

Toby has others up on the same subject that are well worth the time to watch.
Hope this helps.
Cheers,
Eddie B.
Thank you for that. I soaked the clutch mech up in WD40 I'm hoping that if the clutch plate has cooked to the flywheel etc it will help it release. I'll check out that vid and see if it guides me in the right direction.
Had a radical thought, feel free to tell me if I'm crazy. But what about tow starting the dozer, idle the main engine right down and engage the pony, see if the pony will fire up, that will tell me if the pony has pinched up.. Crazy?
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Sun, Jun 26, 2016 11:50 AM
Raeme
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Reply to STEPHEN:
So the last time you started the main engine, I guess the pinion didn't release? It must be malfunctioning, might need to be cleaned up, and checked well for correct operation.


Hmm that is also a good thought. Thank you, the only thing that makes me wonder on that is that the pinion engage lever feels and sounds like it releasing. Could it do that but the pinion stays in? Which would be remove floor plates and find an inspection plate near flywheel housing on the main? I really appreciate these thoughts guys, thanks for taking the time to reply. It's appreciated.
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Sun, Jun 26, 2016 11:54 AM
Raeme
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Reply to Raeme:


Hmm that is also a good thought. Thank you, the only thing that makes me wonder on that is that the pinion engage lever feels and sounds like it releasing. Could it do that but the pinion stays in? Which would be remove floor plates and find an inspection plate near flywheel housing on the main? I really appreciate these thoughts guys, thanks for taking the time to reply. It's appreciated.
Hello. So I went back over to the machine. Removed floor plate and main clutch cover. I found a 3/4 drive plug above the pinion latch mech. Removed all and am quite confident that the pinion isn't stuck on flywheel. I can see the helical drive closer to the fuel tank then at least 2 inches of straight spline on the shaft. I also worked the mech back and forth feels and looks free. When I'm turning over the pony I can see the pinion engage sleeve thru the plug hole turning. So that still looks like the pony clutch has stuck and the shaft is turning with the crank. Do you have to remove the whole engine assembly to repair or rebuild he clutch? Thanks
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Sun, Jun 26, 2016 1:05 PM
Rome K/G
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Reply to Raeme:
Hello. So I went back over to the machine. Removed floor plate and main clutch cover. I found a 3/4 drive plug above the pinion latch mech. Removed all and am quite confident that the pinion isn't stuck on flywheel. I can see the helical drive closer to the fuel tank then at least 2 inches of straight spline on the shaft. I also worked the mech back and forth feels and looks free. When I'm turning over the pony I can see the pinion engage sleeve thru the plug hole turning. So that still looks like the pony clutch has stuck and the shaft is turning with the crank. Do you have to remove the whole engine assembly to repair or rebuild he clutch? Thanks
You may have a pinion shaft bearing locked up. Was the oil in the pony transmission up to level?
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Sun, Jun 26, 2016 9:34 PM
cojhl2
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Reply to Raeme:
Thank you for that. I soaked the clutch mech up in WD40 I'm hoping that if the clutch plate has cooked to the flywheel etc it will help it release. I'll check out that vid and see if it guides me in the right direction.
Had a radical thought, feel free to tell me if I'm crazy. But what about tow starting the dozer, idle the main engine right down and engage the pony, see if the pony will fire up, that will tell me if the pony has pinched up.. Crazy?
[quote="Raeme"]Thank you for that. I soaked the clutch mech up in WD40 I'm hoping that if the clutch plate has cooked to the flywheel etc it will help it release. I'll check out that vid and see if it guides me in the right direction.
Had a radical thought, feel free to tell me if I'm crazy. But what about tow starting the dozer, idle the main engine right down and engage the pony, see if the pony will fire up, that will tell me if the pony has pinched up.. Crazy?[/quote]

i doubt that you could ever get it engaged, but don't ever..ever.. do something like that!!
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Sun, Jun 26, 2016 10:22 PM
Raeme
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Reply to Rome K/G:
You may have a pinion shaft bearing locked up. Was the oil in the pony transmission up to level?


Cheers. Yeah the level in the hi, low trans is ok. Thanks for that.
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Mon, Jun 27, 2016 4:04 AM
Raeme
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Reply to cojhl2:
[quote="Raeme"]Thank you for that. I soaked the clutch mech up in WD40 I'm hoping that if the clutch plate has cooked to the flywheel etc it will help it release. I'll check out that vid and see if it guides me in the right direction.
Had a radical thought, feel free to tell me if I'm crazy. But what about tow starting the dozer, idle the main engine right down and engage the pony, see if the pony will fire up, that will tell me if the pony has pinched up.. Crazy?[/quote]

i doubt that you could ever get it engaged, but don't ever..ever.. do something like that!!


No worries, thought it might have been a kinda nuts idea. I reckon from here I'm going to have to remove the pony and strip it and see what's stuck. Cheers.
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Mon, Jun 27, 2016 4:06 AM
edb
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Reply to Raeme:


No worries, thought it might have been a kinda nuts idea. I reckon from here I'm going to have to remove the pony and strip it and see what's stuck. Cheers.
Hi Reame,
yes, you have to pull the entire pony and transmission to get to the pinion.
There is never anything about pony engines that is easy or quick to do.
Cheers,
Eddie B.
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Mon, Jun 27, 2016 7:21 AM
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