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D4 Steering Clutches

D4 Steering Clutches

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steamroller
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Hey guys;
I read the advice on the heating of the steering hubs on instalation.My question is this,I have a 1" Impact hammer,Used in removing truck tires 1650 ft pounds of torque.With out heating the hub would this be strong enough to install the clutch hubs? If heat is required how hot does it need to be?
Thanks STEAMROLLER
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Mon, Jun 29, 2009 8:23 PM
jmvmopar
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The clutch drums are supposed to be pressed onto the tappered shaft at something like 15-20 tons I don't remember for sure. But no just hammering the nut on won't be enough. They say to just heat the drum till water or spit boils on the surface then jam it together and hammer that nut on. Make sure everything is super clean first.
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Mon, Jun 29, 2009 10:06 PM
OzDozer
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Reply to jmvmopar:
The clutch drums are supposed to be pressed onto the tappered shaft at something like 15-20 tons I don't remember for sure. But no just hammering the nut on won't be enough. They say to just heat the drum till water or spit boils on the surface then jam it together and hammer that nut on. Make sure everything is super clean first.
If it was my project, I'd be investing in the hydraulic ram to press the hubs on. Impact wrenches put a lot of hammering pressure on threads, if you're using them as a substitute press. I'd be concerned about thread damage if installation was done in this manner. A hyd ram applies steady pressure, and you can gauge the pressure on the hub precisely and accurately. There's a little too much scope for error using a air wrench, IMO .. and Cat give precise tonnages to ensure correct fit on the taper. Too little, and the hub comes loose, with resultant devastating damage .. with too much, you have a split hub.
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Tue, Jun 30, 2009 3:22 PM
drujinin
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Reply to OzDozer:
If it was my project, I'd be investing in the hydraulic ram to press the hubs on. Impact wrenches put a lot of hammering pressure on threads, if you're using them as a substitute press. I'd be concerned about thread damage if installation was done in this manner. A hyd ram applies steady pressure, and you can gauge the pressure on the hub precisely and accurately. There's a little too much scope for error using a air wrench, IMO .. and Cat give precise tonnages to ensure correct fit on the taper. Too little, and the hub comes loose, with resultant devastating damage .. with too much, you have a split hub.
I revived the thread on heating verses pressing the clutch and brake hubs on.
After investigating all apparent avenues except building something for a pressing device. I went with heating the brake drum, it went on well but I used only a good 1/2 impact. When I did the clutch hub I apparently didn't use the same heat soak technique as I did on the brake drum and when I air hammered it on, It stopped about 1/16 of an inch short of being flush on the spline.
I gave up and will now have to pull it off and try again or "MAYBE" I can press it on till its flush that last tiny bit?????
If I have to do another steering clutch job on another tractor, I am definitely going to buy a 20 ton pressing device and do it right. After all there are seals, bearings and springs on the shafts and I fear heat damaging those.
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Tue, Jun 30, 2009 7:00 PM
edb
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Reply to drujinin:
I revived the thread on heating verses pressing the clutch and brake hubs on.
After investigating all apparent avenues except building something for a pressing device. I went with heating the brake drum, it went on well but I used only a good 1/2 impact. When I did the clutch hub I apparently didn't use the same heat soak technique as I did on the brake drum and when I air hammered it on, It stopped about 1/16 of an inch short of being flush on the spline.
I gave up and will now have to pull it off and try again or "MAYBE" I can press it on till its flush that last tiny bit?????
If I have to do another steering clutch job on another tractor, I am definitely going to buy a 20 ton pressing device and do it right. After all there are seals, bearings and springs on the shafts and I fear heat damaging those.
Hi Team,
the clutches, sprockets, etc. do not go on to be flush from the factory. There is a certain depth the shaft remains below the drum/sprocket surface to be correctly assembled. Usually if the drum/sprocket goes on flush it is because of worn or over pressed components.
Usual dimension, depending on the component and the size of machine, is between 1/16" to 1/8" of shaft below the drum/sprocket, etc. face.
D4/955 S/C drums, in my experience, even when the splines are correctly degreased will split at the spec. press tonnage of 15 tons. So at The Dealer we always pressed them to 10 to 12 tons with out problems of splitting or coming loose.
Cheers,
Eddie B.
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Tue, Jun 30, 2009 7:23 PM
steamroller
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Reply to edb:
Hi Team,
the clutches, sprockets, etc. do not go on to be flush from the factory. There is a certain depth the shaft remains below the drum/sprocket surface to be correctly assembled. Usually if the drum/sprocket goes on flush it is because of worn or over pressed components.
Usual dimension, depending on the component and the size of machine, is between 1/16" to 1/8" of shaft below the drum/sprocket, etc. face.
D4/955 S/C drums, in my experience, even when the splines are correctly degreased will split at the spec. press tonnage of 15 tons. So at The Dealer we always pressed them to 10 to 12 tons with out problems of splitting or coming loose.
Cheers,
Eddie B.
Hello Guys;
As usual a very good response with good information on the hub install. My options is this, Take unit to Local Cat Shop,Or go to local machine shop with press. OZ where do you find,buy,or rent a hydraulic press?Are you talking new or used?Also what kind of money would be fair? Press on at 12-14 ton pressure.When you guys do this do you put anti-sieze on the shaft? Thanks again STEAMROLLER
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Tue, Jun 30, 2009 7:47 PM
bob
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Reply to steamroller:
Hello Guys;
As usual a very good response with good information on the hub install. My options is this, Take unit to Local Cat Shop,Or go to local machine shop with press. OZ where do you find,buy,or rent a hydraulic press?Are you talking new or used?Also what kind of money would be fair? Press on at 12-14 ton pressure.When you guys do this do you put anti-sieze on the shaft? Thanks again STEAMROLLER
Hey guys, be careful only press to 10 ton and DO NOT GREASE the splines. Press on to clean dry splines.
Later Bob
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Tue, Jun 30, 2009 7:59 PM
drujinin
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Reply to bob:
Hey guys, be careful only press to 10 ton and DO NOT GREASE the splines. Press on to clean dry splines.
Later Bob
Now I know where I should be! and I am there! (hopefully)
I expected less of the adjuster to be sticking out to touch its pivot point and assumed the clutch needed to go on further. I was tired last night when I put it together so have no idea if I am truly good.
If I am good on the spline then how od I correct the adjuster gap issue?

Getting back to the pressing question; there are several 20 ton hollow shaft press cylinders for sale on Ebay that would work to press these on. I am headed off on Vacation with the wife and didn't want to spend the money right now. Which is why I opted to heat instead of press.

drujinin
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Wed, Jul 1, 2009 2:59 AM
OzDozer
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Reply to drujinin:
Now I know where I should be! and I am there! (hopefully)
I expected less of the adjuster to be sticking out to touch its pivot point and assumed the clutch needed to go on further. I was tired last night when I put it together so have no idea if I am truly good.
If I am good on the spline then how od I correct the adjuster gap issue?

Getting back to the pressing question; there are several 20 ton hollow shaft press cylinders for sale on Ebay that would work to press these on. I am headed off on Vacation with the wife and didn't want to spend the money right now. Which is why I opted to heat instead of press.

drujinin
Steamroller - eBay is your friend, when it comes to finding useful bargains, particularly tools.

One of these .. http://cgi.ebay.com/SIMPLEX-P-41-10-000-PSI-Hand-Pump-fits-enerpac-rams-too_W0QQitemZ390013769979

and one of these .. http://cgi.ebay.com/Enerpac-RCH-20-Hydraulic-Ram-Cylinder-20-Ton_W0QQitemZ170349427499

... will see you right for a long time to come, when it somes to basic pressing. Yes, you may have to wait a while for the right deal to come up, close to home .. but save a search on eBay for "hollow ram" and you will get notified any time one appears .. 😊
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Wed, Jul 1, 2009 9:52 PM
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