D13000 electric sets

I can,t find in my Cat SNID book any Gen. sets made that early but the first ones listed were made in around 1954 but someone could have installed an earlier industrial engine on it for some reason so you,d really need to check the engine SN and post it and see if we can go from there.Forget before to list the electric set SNs and they are 29B and 2V and it says the 29B1 and up came out in 1954 and the 2V5001 in 1954 also.

herman J,

Hi,
Back in the year you are asking about, (1943) I think one will find the D13000 electric set was not refer to as such, I think we’ll find they were the “13-66” Electric Set (1942) which had the D13000 engine with the generator having a Kilowatt rating of 75.

Other sets in that era of time were the D17000 was 17-85 Electric Set, D13000 was, 13-66 Electric Set, D11000 was 11-52 Electric Set, D8800 was 88-50 Electric Set and so.

[color=Blue]“ Caterpillar Diesel Electric Sets are built as a “package” and are available with either self-regulating or externally regulated A.C. generators.
Self-regulating sets require no switchboard, automatic voltage regulator or other external control apparatus. They have excellent large electric motor starting performance, are easily paralleled with any number of like units and fit most electric energy requirements.
Externally regulated sets require external control apparatus. A control cabinet (including necessary equipment )which mounts directly on generator is available for sets with voltages up to and including 480 volts. Sets with 2400 volt generators require a switchboard with necessary equipment which also is available from your “Caterpillar” dealer

Note: *** kilowatt is for polyphase.60 cycle set with full equipment but with out radiator fan, single phase and 50 cycle sets are also available * these size sets can be converted to national gas.
(The 1942 Caterpillar Product Catalog)"[/color]

All of my serial number books start with the D13000 Engines & Power units in 1947 through 1953. The D13000 Electric Set (2V, series) 1947 through 1953, D13000 Industrial Engine (1T series) 1950 through 1953, and the 13000 Industrial Engine (4S series) 1947 through 1953.

Kelly

Kelly is your book from Cat or not.I have the Cat SN sales book from the Cat dealer I worked for and it doesn,t agree with your years of startup on the D13000.Take for example the 2V00001 and up to 5000 is a D17000 V-8 engine starting at 1947 and then the D13000 started at 5001 and started production at 1954,and these are both electric sets.There were so many D13000 SNs made and listed in the book but only the two I listed in my first reply are electric and the other ones are industrial and marine and were the 29B and the 2V5001 and up.

Yes SJ,
I follow you on the 2V1-up starting out on the D17000 engine and jumping to the D13000 engine at 2V5001-up.

There is confusion on the designation of these units (at least for me) as to when they are referred to as Gen sets, Power units, and Engines & Electric sets which go back much farther than the 2V, 1T, 4S, 28B on the D13000, possibly as early as 1934. Can anybody shed any light? (bad pun)

Here's some info to add to the mix😊 😊

SJ,
No they are not Cat's Sn books. But one, does show both of the D17000 and the D13000 under the same 2V series and of course there starting date and numbers are not the same as yours. What’s interesting to me at least, is the starting production date as 1954. Is that by chance part of the answer to OM question?

Kelly

Hi Team,
here is the relevant page from a Tech Sheet from Cat Dated 1957 for Current and non-current Cat engines. Note :- there is no section for non-current Electric Sets only current, no doubt indicating the start date as the date of the first introduction of the relevant Electric Set by "Caterpillar"
No doubt other makers of Electric Generators, prior to these dates, have fitted Cat Engines to their Gens and offered them for sale as package sets.
Cheers,
Eddie B.

Is the answer then that Cat did not package a gen set until 1947??

Seems odd to me that the two Operator's Instruction manuals I posted contain considerable amount of generator information and integrated with the engine operation. The manuals do mention oem suppliers such as GE, Eseco, Woodward, etc but to me it is described as though Cat was the unitizer of the
package😕 😕

Kelly,
Can you elaborate a little more on that double numbering identification you mentioned? I have not run into that before. Any mention of who became the oem for the package?

I see listings for parts catalogs for d4600 Diesel powered generator from 1940 and several other similar sets of that vintage, there is a listing for two parts catalogs for electric sets, published in 1934 but I think that is a typo, probably meant 1943, looking at the publication number.

There are many typos in many Cat publications, and two of the worst for typos are the Cat Performance Handbook .. followed by the Serial/Product ID Number Index. I try to cross-check as much as possible .. but even Cat themselves don't know what they did in the past, a lot of the time. Don't forget the big fire in the Cat building around 1940 that destroyed a lot of records.

The genset/industrial engines questions appear to me, to be as follows. I am using genuine Cat sales catalogs here, as the best guide.

1. Cat appear to have produced factory gensets from 1937. The 1938 catalog lists them all .. but under the heading of "engines". Seven gensets are listed, and known under the engine model that drove them .. D17000 (80KW), D13000 (60KW), D11000 (50KW), D8800 (40KW), D7700 (35KW), D6600 (30KW), D4400 (20KW).
These units were not self-contained or self-regulating. They were designed to be hooked into a separate switchboard with controls on it. These units were available in AC or DC power.

1938 Genset Catalog .. http://img410.imageshack.us/img410/9917/catgensets1938.jpg

2. By late 1939, the range had changed and expanded substantially. There were now, NINE gensets in the range.
The range was now split - into "Caterpillar Diesel Electric Sets (DES) - these were "self-contained and self-regulating" sets. They were self exciting, integrated units, with Caterpillar generators, that required no external control apparatus.
The second group were known as " Caterpillar Diesel powered Electric Sets" (DPES), and these were Caterpillar Industrial engines driving any of several makes of AC or DC generator, and all required external control apparatus (confusing, huh??) ..

The three smallest Cat gensets were the self-contained, "Caterpillar Diesel Electric Sets", and were now known as the 46-30 DES, the 44-20 DES and the 34-15 DES. They were powered by the D4600, the D4400 and the D3400, respectively.

The six largest gensets were the "DPES" style, and were - D17000 (85KW), D13000 (66KW), D11000 (52 KW), D8800 (41KW), D7700 (34KW), and D6600 (30KW).
The D11000, D7700 and D6600 ceased production between late 1940 and early 1942.

1940 Genset Catalog (page 1) .. http://img72.imageshack.us/img72/6573/catgensets19401.jpg

1940 Genset Catalog (page 2) .. http://img72.imageshack.us/img72/5224/catgensets19402.jpg

3. During WW2, the DES nomenclature was extended, as the range of gensets produced by Cat comprised more and more DES "integrated" gensets. Thus we have the larger DES models as described by Kelly in his first post, filling out the range.
There would have been increased demand for DES sets during WW2, as the military would have wanted integrated gensets to reduce the amount of work required to set them up, when they moved into a recently-conquered area.

4. By 1946, the previous DES nomenclature had been dropped for all gensets. They were once again, merely known by their engine model number. The two types - integrated, self-regulating .. and externally regulated .. were still listed. The model range was back to SIX models.
The catalogs show engines lumped together under "Industrial - Marine - Electric set". However, the early 1947 catalog lists the "Industrial", "Marine", and "Diesel Electric sets" as separate groups on the "General Specifications" page.
In 1946/47, the D17000, D13000 and D8800 diesels all ran at 900 RPM .. and the D4600, the D4400 and the D34000 all ran at 1200RPM.

Early 1947 Cat genset specs .. http://img72.imageshack.us/img72/2804/catgensets1947.jpg

(Within a few weeks of this above catalog date, the last three engines were obsolete, being replaced by the "new", D318, D315, and D311).

5. Remember that Cat did not use a S/N prefix exclusively for one model. They often picked out a "block" of numbers under one S/N prefix .. then went on to a separate, higher block of numbers under the same prefix, for a different model.
Thus we typically have .. 2V1-2V5000 S/No's for the D17000 genset .. and 2V5001-2V9999 S/No's for the D13000 genset.

Also .. there was nothing stopping anyone from obtaining a new industrial engine and hooking it to a generator, of any make, and thus acquiring a "Caterpillar genset". It's likely that a number of factories producing generators did this, if a customer wanted a Cat powering his genset. It could also be done by an individual or a company.

The D13000 was produced in industrial form from 1934 to 1955 .. and appears to have been produced in Cat factory genset form, from late 1937 to early 1955. I have a "UCERC" S/N book that is not always accurate, and not surprisingly, it only lists the D13000 from 1947 .. yet with a S/N of 2V3754 as the starting S/N in 1947.
As we know from standard Cat practice, they didn't start S/No's with an oddball number .. it was always from a round number .. usually from 001, sometimes from 501 .. but never a random number.
Accordingly, cross checking tells me the 2V S/N prefix includes one of only two D13000 "electric sets" listed in the Serial/ ID Product number index .. and that D13000 genset starts at S/N 2V5001, with no start date given. Thus, the UCERC book is wrong on this one.
The only other "electric set" S/N prefix given is 29B prefix. This appears to be a later S/N .. possibly raised as a replacement S/N for the D13000 genset, after the 2V S/No's ran out at 2V9999.