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Cat 951c oil problem

Cat 951c oil problem

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uisum
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Hello everybody .
I have a 951c 69h3136 crawler loader. I noticed that the converter oil has risen beyond the full limit of the control rod.
The transmission oil, on the other hand, has dropped below the limit.
Is it possible somehow that the transmission oil ends up inside the converter?
What happens if the converter gets too full?
Thank you all .
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Fri, May 28, 2021 12:55 AM
Fat Dan
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let met get some time and I go through my Op.& Mant. manuals.
good question.
A true guru will stop by soon,
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Fri, May 28, 2021 3:12 AM
Old Magnet
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Reply to Fat Dan:
let met get some time and I go through my Op.& Mant. manuals.
good question.
A true guru will stop by soon,
My parts book does not show a level gauge (dip stick) for the converter, just the one on the transmission.
There is no scavenge pump as converter leakage flow is back to the transmission sump. The transmission pump is incorporated into the converter/transmission case so pump seal leakage is not a problem. If the torque converter leakage is excessive it will build a higher level in the housing and lead to higher torque converter oil temperature, foaming and possible loss of power. Be sure to check that the transmission case vent is clear.
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Fri, May 28, 2021 3:40 AM
Glum
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Reply to Old Magnet:
My parts book does not show a level gauge (dip stick) for the converter, just the one on the transmission.
There is no scavenge pump as converter leakage flow is back to the transmission sump. The transmission pump is incorporated into the converter/transmission case so pump seal leakage is not a problem. If the torque converter leakage is excessive it will build a higher level in the housing and lead to higher torque converter oil temperature, foaming and possible loss of power. Be sure to check that the transmission case vent is clear.
I think you are mistaking the bevel gear and steering clutch compartment's dipstick for that of the transmission.
Like OM said, converter leakage flows back to the transmission sump with no scavenge pump involved as far as I know. I might be way off but my undertanding is that the 951 is set up similar to the D4's as far as power train is concerned.
If rear end oil is dropping and trans/converter oil rising, the usual suspect would be the trans pinion seal. 
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Fri, May 28, 2021 11:14 AM
uisum
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Reply to Glum:
I think you are mistaking the bevel gear and steering clutch compartment's dipstick for that of the transmission.
Like OM said, converter leakage flows back to the transmission sump with no scavenge pump involved as far as I know. I might be way off but my undertanding is that the 951 is set up similar to the D4's as far as power train is concerned.
If rear end oil is dropping and trans/converter oil rising, the usual suspect would be the trans pinion seal. 
hello , yes I have confused transmission with brake housing and steering clutches.
The converter level as already mentioned has an oil level that has risen beyond the full mark. This is after about 15 hours of use.
I must say that the machine does not give any problems after 3/4 hours of use.
On the other hand, the oil level of the steering clutch box (under the seat) has dropped a lot. There are no losses under the wagon.
I assume that the steering clutches housing causes oil to fall into the torque converter.
What to check? are there o-rings between the two boxes?
Thank you all
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Fri, May 28, 2021 4:38 PM
Old Magnet
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Reply to uisum:
hello , yes I have confused transmission with brake housing and steering clutches.
The converter level as already mentioned has an oil level that has risen beyond the full mark. This is after about 15 hours of use.
I must say that the machine does not give any problems after 3/4 hours of use.
On the other hand, the oil level of the steering clutch box (under the seat) has dropped a lot. There are no losses under the wagon.
I assume that the steering clutches housing causes oil to fall into the torque converter.
What to check? are there o-rings between the two boxes?
Thank you all
Your not paying attention. As Glum mentioned the leakage source between the bevel gear compartment and transmission would be the bevel gear/transmission pinion seal. Big job to replace.
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Fri, May 28, 2021 10:38 PM
Glum
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Reply to Old Magnet:
Your not paying attention. As Glum mentioned the leakage source between the bevel gear compartment and transmission would be the bevel gear/transmission pinion seal. Big job to replace.
Machine on blocks and drop transmission. You can then remove the pinion assembly and replace the seal. In all likelihood there are other issues that are the cause of the leaking seal.
The Avspare website won't let me look at your serial number, but there are a few variations of the pinion shaft assembly. One of them has a sleeve on the pinion retained by a large nut which the seal runs on. It is not uncommon for the nut to come loose and the sleeve move away from its position. I seem to remember that Caterpillar even updated the thickness of the lock for the nut to prevent this happening. 
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Fri, May 28, 2021 10:56 PM
Old Magnet
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Here's the 951C standard transfer gear section with pinion.....unless it has the optional attachment PTO drive.
 [attachment=63477]951C-Transfer-gears.jpg[/attachment]
Attachment
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Fri, May 28, 2021 11:46 PM
Glum
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Reply to Old Magnet:
My parts book does not show a level gauge (dip stick) for the converter, just the one on the transmission.
There is no scavenge pump as converter leakage flow is back to the transmission sump. The transmission pump is incorporated into the converter/transmission case so pump seal leakage is not a problem. If the torque converter leakage is excessive it will build a higher level in the housing and lead to higher torque converter oil temperature, foaming and possible loss of power. Be sure to check that the transmission case vent is clear.
Not to say this is the correct way of doing things by any means but I recall one of the old bb users, AJ, mentioning that in a pinch he connected the two compartments via their drain plugs, keeping the levels about equal to help an owner complete a job, and that he saw the same machine years later still operating with his temporary setup.
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Sat, May 29, 2021 12:06 AM
neil
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Reply to Glum:
Not to say this is the correct way of doing things by any means but I recall one of the old bb users, AJ, mentioning that in a pinch he connected the two compartments via their drain plugs, keeping the levels about equal to help an owner complete a job, and that he saw the same machine years later still operating with his temporary setup.
That's a smart workaround Glum - I like it!
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Sat, May 29, 2021 4:51 AM
Old Magnet
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Reply to neil:
That's a smart workaround Glum - I like it!
Until the cobble connection gets knocked off then you lose both the transmission/torque converter and bevel gear.
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Sat, May 29, 2021 6:58 AM
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