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Cat 10 Won't Run, Ideas please?

Cat 10 Won't Run, Ideas please?

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Mick
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Hi There, I really need help with this one!

I am having trouble getting one of my TEN's running properly, and I am all out of ideas.

It will start and run, roughly. It wanted to rev, but kept shutting down. I checked the spark timing, all OK.

I then swapped the complete carburettor off a good running TEN, the problem stayed, identical.

I noticed the Governor was trying to pull it to no fuel, no matter where the throttle was positioned.

I removed the throttle linkage off the carburettor and managed to get the engine running quite well, however once the engine had

been running and warmed up, it shut down again. I got it going but then it would only run with the choke fully on. Problem

stayed with both carburettors.

Has anyone got any suggestions why the governor may be pulling to no fuel even with desired throttle at high?

Warm/hot engine only run (poorly) with choke on?

It is beginning to frustrate me
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Sun, Jul 13, 2014 5:52 PM
mrsmackpaul
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Mick sounds like you have a vacume leak if runs with the choke on its getting to much air and it wont be spark at all and it s not fuel because you have changed carbys that only leaves the air hope this helps

Paul
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Sun, Jul 13, 2014 6:17 PM
Steve A
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Reply to mrsmackpaul:
Mick sounds like you have a vacume leak if runs with the choke on its getting to much air and it wont be spark at all and it s not fuel because you have changed carbys that only leaves the air hope this helps

Paul
Check the passage through the block, I have heard of these cracking and allowing crank case gas to dilute your air fuel mixture, also check the intake manifold, its possible there is a hole or crack on the inside that would cause the same problem. Needless to say a good seal between the intake and block is very important, I have had manifolds resurfaced on the same machine they use to surface cylinder heads (big surface grinder)
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Sun, Jul 13, 2014 7:06 PM
drujinin
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Reply to Steve A:
Check the passage through the block, I have heard of these cracking and allowing crank case gas to dilute your air fuel mixture, also check the intake manifold, its possible there is a hole or crack on the inside that would cause the same problem. Needless to say a good seal between the intake and block is very important, I have had manifolds resurfaced on the same machine they use to surface cylinder heads (big surface grinder)
Is it possible the Governor Spring broke a coil?
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Sun, Jul 13, 2014 7:20 PM
8C 361
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Reply to drujinin:
Is it possible the Governor Spring broke a coil?
I suspect the passage through the block. I had that problem with my 8C 20. It had freeze cracks and it seemed to be cracked into the water jacket. I was able to drive a piece of 1" copper pipe through the passage and epoxy the ends and dress them smooth. The ten might be similar.
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Sun, Jul 13, 2014 8:37 PM
ronm
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[quote="Mick"]Hi There, I really need help with this one!


Has anyone got any suggestions why the governor may be pulling to no fuel even with desired throttle at high?

[/quote]

That's what governors do. The spring opens the throttle, the governor closes it. Is the spring broken or that weak that it can't overcome the governor? If the idle circuit in the carb is not working, the engine will start to die when the throttle closes, then the governor catches it & opens up...this repeats itself & the engine "hunts"...I agree with the others you may have a vacuum leak, it will cause the same effect.
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Sun, Jul 13, 2014 8:46 PM
ShawnStover
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Reply to ronm:
[quote="Mick"]Hi There, I really need help with this one!


Has anyone got any suggestions why the governor may be pulling to no fuel even with desired throttle at high?

[/quote]

That's what governors do. The spring opens the throttle, the governor closes it. Is the spring broken or that weak that it can't overcome the governor? If the idle circuit in the carb is not working, the engine will start to die when the throttle closes, then the governor catches it & opens up...this repeats itself & the engine "hunts"...I agree with the others you may have a vacuum leak, it will cause the same effect.
Have you tried to override the governor and run the throttle linkage by hand at the carb? If it runs fine doing that, it could be a governor issue. But my suspicion is a vacuum leak. Easiest way to find out is to take a can of carb cleaner or ether and spray all around the intake manifold with the engine running (be careful for fire sources!). If the engine revs itself up while spraying, you've found your intake leak. Use the ether conservatively as ether has a LOT more punch than the gasoline, and can sometimes make the engine go knocka-knocka-bang-bang for a second as the stuff ignites in the cylinder. This is a very easy and safe method for finding an intake leak, but just remember a little goes a long way!! Hope this helps!
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Mon, Jul 14, 2014 12:55 PM
Mick
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Reply to ShawnStover:
Have you tried to override the governor and run the throttle linkage by hand at the carb? If it runs fine doing that, it could be a governor issue. But my suspicion is a vacuum leak. Easiest way to find out is to take a can of carb cleaner or ether and spray all around the intake manifold with the engine running (be careful for fire sources!). If the engine revs itself up while spraying, you've found your intake leak. Use the ether conservatively as ether has a LOT more punch than the gasoline, and can sometimes make the engine go knocka-knocka-bang-bang for a second as the stuff ignites in the cylinder. This is a very easy and safe method for finding an intake leak, but just remember a little goes a long way!! Hope this helps!
Hey Guys,
thanks for all the input. I will not get a chance to play with it again till friday.

Would anyone have any information on the governor? even a parts diagram, I have not pulled one down before.

When I had the throttle linkage off, the hand throttle to governor at high idle and the engine free revving towards a high idle, the governor was still pulling back to no fuel.

I think I have a combination of all the suggested faults, which is a bit scary!

I will post an outcome as soon as I look at it again,

thank you again

Mick.
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Mon, Jul 14, 2014 5:11 PM
Steve A
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Reply to Mick:
Hey Guys,
thanks for all the input. I will not get a chance to play with it again till friday.

Would anyone have any information on the governor? even a parts diagram, I have not pulled one down before.

When I had the throttle linkage off, the hand throttle to governor at high idle and the engine free revving towards a high idle, the governor was still pulling back to no fuel.

I think I have a combination of all the suggested faults, which is a bit scary!

I will post an outcome as soon as I look at it again,

thank you again

Mick.
Mick

I have new governor springs available for a Cat 10 if you need one
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Tue, Jul 15, 2014 5:54 AM
edb
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Reply to Steve A:
Mick

I have new governor springs available for a Cat 10 if you need one
Hi Mick,
scan below is for a 15 but is essentially the same setup.
Left clicking on the scan a further twice will make it larger.
Hope this helps.
Cheers,
Eddie B.
Attachment
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Tue, Jul 15, 2014 11:10 AM
Mick
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Reply to edb:
Hi Mick,
scan below is for a 15 but is essentially the same setup.
Left clicking on the scan a further twice will make it larger.
Hope this helps.
Cheers,
Eddie B.
Attachment
Hi Guys,
Firstly, thank you to every one who posted replies, with out your help I was not getting any where.

I had a chance to look at it again today. What I found was the manifold bolts were loose, possibly creating a loss in vacuum.

I also removed the fuel priming cups on the inlet and plugged the holes, to eliminate them as a possible problem.

Governor to carburettor linkage is disconnected.

Now the engine runs smoothly and consistently, ran for about 1 hour at various speeds etc. Stopped and restarted when hot with

no problems.

Governor still indicated a problem, I am nearly positive it will be a problem with the spring. If I hook it up the engine just hunts till

it stalls.

Thank you again to all the input, looks like the problem is 90% solved!

Mick.
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Sat, Jul 19, 2014 6:07 AM
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