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941 Transmission Operating Tempature

941 Transmission Operating Tempature

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Jimer
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I have a 941 and after about 2-3 hrs of hard work the transmission oil temp gets close to red. It brings water temp up with it. If I stop and let it idle for a few minutes it the water comes back down. Its takes about 10-15 minutes of idling to bring Trans temp back down. i've put a new Tstat in and check the temps.

185 at thermostat housing when almost at red. measured with laser gun
190 when probed through radiator cap with gauge almost at red.
So i don't think the engine is getting to hot

Trans cooler has 20 degree drop from inlet to outlet
230 inlet tube at oil cooler measured with laser gun
210 on outlet tube of oil cooer
This is why i think the transmission is getting hotter than it should

The main question I have is what is normal operating temperature for the transmission. I've heard 941 and 951 are prone to cooling issues Gauge is almost at red i haven't pushed it to hard to see how hot it will actually go for obvious reasons.
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Mon, Jan 29, 2018 10:06 AM
edb
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Hi Jimer,
doing some research in some grey Caterpillar Operation and Maintenance Instructions books I find it said that 250 deg. F is the maximum safe operating Temperature limit for the trans oil. This should be at the RED Range on a correctly calibrated Trans Temp Gauge.
Any anticipated continued use above this temp a lower gear should be selected or lighten the load.

--in another publication on using a hydraulic retarder in a scraper tractor it says to not let the retarder temp exceed 275 deg. F. To my way of thinking this would be an absolute short time limit or the oil would deteriorate.

Chart below should give some indication of test figures for Troubleshooting a cooling system.

Cool down is I feel is best achieved at around half+ engine speed--more oil and air flow.

If your unit is fitted with a problematic air to oil TC oil cooler that clogged their fins easily in land clearing from dust, grass and leaf trash.
If in dusty conditions and some one hosed out the cooler and started operating again before the water had dried completely the dust/mud would solidify and be very difficult to remove short of removing the core and soaking etc.

We had a big problem with these in early days as owners ordered machines with rock guards and operated them in mud/clay. This would build up around the rollers and cause big drag that slowed the machine, robbed power and caused T/C overheating.
Overnight the mud in the rock guards would dry somewhat and stick in place causing drag forever more.
Removing the rock guards and cleaning out the spaces above the rollers and track frame alleviated the drag and overheat problem.

You seem to have good in spec. cooling for the T/C cooler.
Often we found on older units that the Fan shrouding, any rubber strips/flaps and cover plating could be missing, this reduces the air flow thru the radiator and cooler further adding to heating problems.
Hope this helps.
Cheers,
Eddie B.
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Tue, Jan 30, 2018 10:01 AM
Old Magnet
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Reply to edb:
Hi Jimer,
doing some research in some grey Caterpillar Operation and Maintenance Instructions books I find it said that 250 deg. F is the maximum safe operating Temperature limit for the trans oil. This should be at the RED Range on a correctly calibrated Trans Temp Gauge.
Any anticipated continued use above this temp a lower gear should be selected or lighten the load.

--in another publication on using a hydraulic retarder in a scraper tractor it says to not let the retarder temp exceed 275 deg. F. To my way of thinking this would be an absolute short time limit or the oil would deteriorate.

Chart below should give some indication of test figures for Troubleshooting a cooling system.

Cool down is I feel is best achieved at around half+ engine speed--more oil and air flow.

If your unit is fitted with a problematic air to oil TC oil cooler that clogged their fins easily in land clearing from dust, grass and leaf trash.
If in dusty conditions and some one hosed out the cooler and started operating again before the water had dried completely the dust/mud would solidify and be very difficult to remove short of removing the core and soaking etc.

We had a big problem with these in early days as owners ordered machines with rock guards and operated them in mud/clay. This would build up around the rollers and cause big drag that slowed the machine, robbed power and caused T/C overheating.
Overnight the mud in the rock guards would dry somewhat and stick in place causing drag forever more.
Removing the rock guards and cleaning out the spaces above the rollers and track frame alleviated the drag and overheat problem.

You seem to have good in spec. cooling for the T/C cooler.
Often we found on older units that the Fan shrouding, any rubber strips/flaps and cover plating could be missing, this reduces the air flow thru the radiator and cooler further adding to heating problems.
Hope this helps.
Cheers,
Eddie B.
Attachment
The 941 uses an oil to water heat exchanger. At a 20 degree differential I'd say there probably is some fouling on the oil side.
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Tue, Jan 30, 2018 10:36 AM
catsilver
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Reply to Old Magnet:
The 941 uses an oil to water heat exchanger. At a 20 degree differential I'd say there probably is some fouling on the oil side.
Not enough oil going through the cooler, probably internal leakage in the converter.
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Wed, Jan 31, 2018 1:03 AM
Jimer
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Reply to catsilver:
Not enough oil going through the cooler, probably internal leakage in the converter.
Im using it to clear land. I keep the radiator blown out and clean as well as UC shoveled out. I only run it in 1st when pushing 2nd to move across site. Never 3rd as I've heard its hard on UC. Im gonna push it a little harder the next dry day we get to work and reevaluate. It only gets up there after several hrs work. They are calling for rain a lot so it might be a week or so but i will keep you posted on the findings. I know oil to water coolers will keep the trans oil a little hotter than coolant. but I'm still not 100% sure if its a Transmission over heating issue or maybe radiator or oil cooler partially clogged or low coolant flow. Going to troubleshoot a little further and see where that leads. Thanks for the input.
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Wed, Jan 31, 2018 9:30 AM
Jimer
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Reply to Old Magnet:
The 941 uses an oil to water heat exchanger. At a 20 degree differential I'd say there probably is some fouling on the oil side.

What do you mean oil fouling? Like buildup?
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Wed, Jan 31, 2018 9:32 AM
catsilver
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Reply to Jimer:

What do you mean oil fouling? Like buildup?
The only time I've come across this is when a mechanic failed to clean out the cooler after a converter blow-up!
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Wed, Jan 31, 2018 6:06 PM
Jimer
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Reply to catsilver:
The only time I've come across this is when a mechanic failed to clean out the cooler after a converter blow-up!
Oil cooler was stopped up on the coolant side. It was preventing coolant from flowing through the trans cooler and engine. Cleaned it out. Waiting on dry weather to test it out.
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Thu, Mar 1, 2018 10:08 AM
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