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1964 hydraulic system

1964 hydraulic system

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jamesdiederich
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My brothers have a 1964 D4 which has lost all hydraulic pressure. What could be the cause? Where is the bypass or relief valve located? Thanks.
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Mon, Apr 23, 2012 12:37 AM
Old Magnet
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Has this got the factory hydraulics with dash mounted unit?
Post the s/n of the machine and the s/n of the hydraulic tank (tag on tank) if this is the type.
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Mon, Apr 23, 2012 2:52 AM
jamesdiederich
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Reply to Old Magnet:
Has this got the factory hydraulics with dash mounted unit?
Post the s/n of the machine and the s/n of the hydraulic tank (tag on tank) if this is the type.
I'll check and post it in a couple of days.
Thanks.
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Tue, Apr 24, 2012 3:14 AM
jamesdiederich
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Reply to jamesdiederich:
I'll check and post it in a couple of days.
Thanks.
The s/n of the machine is 64D4C40A480. The book has the number 49F-828 on it for the hydraulic system but we do not if this is the serial number. We need to clean the tank off to find the number on it. The hydraulics are factory original with the tank and valves located in front of the dash. My brother looked in the tank with the engine running and could not see any fluid movement.
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Wed, Apr 25, 2012 2:02 AM
Old Magnet
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Reply to jamesdiederich:
The s/n of the machine is 64D4C40A480. The book has the number 49F-828 on it for the hydraulic system but we do not if this is the serial number. We need to clean the tank off to find the number on it. The hydraulics are factory original with the tank and valves located in front of the dash. My brother looked in the tank with the engine running and could not see any fluid movement.
OK, I have the info for the 49E-828 (it's an E instead of F) hydraulic system but it will be later this evening before I can get to it.

Have you checked anything else, like strainer or pump operation?
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Wed, Apr 25, 2012 2:58 AM
jamesdiederich
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Reply to Old Magnet:
OK, I have the info for the 49E-828 (it's an E instead of F) hydraulic system but it will be later this evening before I can get to it.

Have you checked anything else, like strainer or pump operation?
My brother bleed the air per the instructions in the manual. I don't think he has checked anything else but I will ask. He was using the dozer to push a tree and the hydraulics quit. It had worked fine without and problems up to that point.
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Wed, Apr 25, 2012 6:39 AM
Old Magnet
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Reply to jamesdiederich:
My brother bleed the air per the instructions in the manual. I don't think he has checked anything else but I will ask. He was using the dozer to push a tree and the hydraulics quit. It had worked fine without and problems up to that point.
First thing to check is the hydraulic filter.....takes a Wix 51165 or Napa 1165 disposable element.

This shows as a 29 gpm 2-valve system for dozer operation and one rear implement. Does that match what you have.

The relief valve and control valves are located in the tank.

The vane type pump is mounted to the front of the engine as shown.
If there is no flow after checking the filter I would suspect that something has happened to the pump.

How do you want to proceed? If tear down is required I can provide the info as required? or??

You mentioned having a manual, what does it cover?

Edit:
The hydraulic filter does have a by-pass relief valve so flow would not normally be stopped.....do need to check filter for trash as a possible indicator of failure.
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Wed, Apr 25, 2012 7:45 AM
Dozerman51
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Reply to Old Magnet:
First thing to check is the hydraulic filter.....takes a Wix 51165 or Napa 1165 disposable element.

This shows as a 29 gpm 2-valve system for dozer operation and one rear implement. Does that match what you have.

The relief valve and control valves are located in the tank.

The vane type pump is mounted to the front of the engine as shown.
If there is no flow after checking the filter I would suspect that something has happened to the pump.

How do you want to proceed? If tear down is required I can provide the info as required? or??

You mentioned having a manual, what does it cover?

Edit:
The hydraulic filter does have a by-pass relief valve so flow would not normally be stopped.....do need to check filter for trash as a possible indicator of failure.
Hello Old Magnet,
Hey, I see the D4 in the pic you show has the "Buzzbomb" pony. Any chance you could post some pic's of the "Buzzbomb" Pony, both electric start and the recoil start models and the starter clutch and pinion controls? Just my curiousity getting the better of me. Never have seen one in the flesh so to speak. Thanks.👋
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Wed, Apr 25, 2012 12:25 PM
D4C Charlie
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Reply to Dozerman51:
Hello Old Magnet,
Hey, I see the D4 in the pic you show has the "Buzzbomb" pony. Any chance you could post some pic's of the "Buzzbomb" Pony, both electric start and the recoil start models and the starter clutch and pinion controls? Just my curiousity getting the better of me. Never have seen one in the flesh so to speak. Thanks.👋
Probably a long shot but when I changed the hyd pump on my D4 the shaft that the drive gear is on is only a tapered shaft. No keyway no spline nothing but a tapered shaft and how do you tighten the nut to get a good tight fit? Could that gear not be turning the pump?
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Wed, Apr 25, 2012 10:59 PM
Old Magnet
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Reply to D4C Charlie:
Probably a long shot but when I changed the hyd pump on my D4 the shaft that the drive gear is on is only a tapered shaft. No keyway no spline nothing but a tapered shaft and how do you tighten the nut to get a good tight fit? Could that gear not be turning the pump?
Not a long shot at all, early pumps (before they discovered splines) were held on a tapered shaft with a lock tab washer and nut torqued to 100 ft-lbs.
The drive gear may have worked loose, lock tab missing or not installed properly or not unheard of to break shaft.

Next best item to be checked out....
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Thu, Apr 26, 2012 12:01 AM
jamesdiederich
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Reply to Old Magnet:
Not a long shot at all, early pumps (before they discovered splines) were held on a tapered shaft with a lock tab washer and nut torqued to 100 ft-lbs.
The drive gear may have worked loose, lock tab missing or not installed properly or not unheard of to break shaft.

Next best item to be checked out....
Thanks for the pointers. I'll tell my brother to remove the pump. He removed the bleed screw at the filter and the flow did not change whether the engine was running or not. As I said he also did not see any fluid movement in the tank with he engine running which points to the pump not doing anything. Maybe it is the tapered shaft problem. I doubt the pump has ever been off has the machine has less than 4000 hours. My brother also told me he just bought a D5H so now he'll sell the D4. I'm going to miss it.
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Thu, Apr 26, 2012 9:25 PM
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