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using D4 4g parts on D4 5t cat...

using D4 4g parts on D4 5t cat...

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derschafer
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I have inherited a D4 5T cat. I'm told that one of the uncles started to do some repairs and then the cat sat in the rain and certainly has water in the engine. I have an opportunity to pick up a D4 4g for next to nothing. I would just like to know if I could use the parts from the D4 4g on the D4 5T?

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Sun, Jul 16, 2017 11:59 PM
Mike Meyer
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Welcome to ACMOC, congratulations on scoring a old D4, from my limited experience of owning a 4G D4 and a 2T D4 there are a lot of parts that will swap straight in including the main motor, pilot motor, transmission and most undercarriage parts like rollers and track chains, there were subtle internal and external changes in those older D4's between 1936 to 1945 and I assume the 4G is a narrow gauge tractor but I think you are onto a winner with your game plan. We look forward to seeing some photo's.
Good luck with the restoration, those old D4's really have a nice bark when they are working hard.
Regards
Mike
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Mon, Jul 17, 2017 3:50 AM
Old Magnet
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Reply to Mike Meyer:
Welcome to ACMOC, congratulations on scoring a old D4, from my limited experience of owning a 4G D4 and a 2T D4 there are a lot of parts that will swap straight in including the main motor, pilot motor, transmission and most undercarriage parts like rollers and track chains, there were subtle internal and external changes in those older D4's between 1936 to 1945 and I assume the 4G is a narrow gauge tractor but I think you are onto a winner with your game plan. We look forward to seeing some photo's.
Good luck with the restoration, those old D4's really have a nice bark when they are working hard.
Regards
Mike
I wouldn't say there was that much interchangeability. Many changes during the 4G model run and although assemblies will interchange with the 5T a lot of individual parts will not.
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Mon, Jul 17, 2017 6:17 AM
Mike Meyer
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Reply to Old Magnet:
I wouldn't say there was that much interchangeability. Many changes during the 4G model run and although assemblies will interchange with the 5T a lot of individual parts will not.
If it is simply a diesel engine swap then the various inlet / exhaust and water manifolds on both the main and pilot will switch between the 4G and 5T engines won't they Pete, there is obviously some difference with the firewall and throttle linkages.
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Mon, Jul 17, 2017 7:23 AM
Old Magnet
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Reply to Mike Meyer:
If it is simply a diesel engine swap then the various inlet / exhaust and water manifolds on both the main and pilot will switch between the 4G and 5T engines won't they Pete, there is obviously some difference with the firewall and throttle linkages.
To many differences to list. Also depend on s/n's. Manifolds are different, governors are different, injectors change from clamp down to threaded, track trucks, carrier rollers are different, some s/n sprocket part numbers change etc.
Internals are fairly consistent. Study up on the parts books and see for yourself and actually compare s/n's of what you have.
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Mon, Jul 17, 2017 8:02 AM
Mike Meyer
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Reply to Old Magnet:
To many differences to list. Also depend on s/n's. Manifolds are different, governors are different, injectors change from clamp down to threaded, track trucks, carrier rollers are different, some s/n sprocket part numbers change etc.
Internals are fairly consistent. Study up on the parts books and see for yourself and actually compare s/n's of what you have.
I agree Pete that a lot of the later 5T parts are different to the 4G but am I wrong in assuming both models at their core share the D4400 diesel engine and that the bolt on parts such as the head, water pump, fuel tower and governor, water, inlet and exhaust manifolds will transfer from a 5T back on to a 4G main motor because that was the question I thought was being asked, if the 5T engine was possibly ruined from water damage could the tractor be saved by using a local free 4G D4 short motor as a donor, or if not being a purist, could you simply bolt a complete RD4 engine with radiator onto a 5T transmission, is that possible?
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Mon, Jul 17, 2017 11:50 AM
Old Magnet
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Reply to Mike Meyer:
I agree Pete that a lot of the later 5T parts are different to the 4G but am I wrong in assuming both models at their core share the D4400 diesel engine and that the bolt on parts such as the head, water pump, fuel tower and governor, water, inlet and exhaust manifolds will transfer from a 5T back on to a 4G main motor because that was the question I thought was being asked, if the 5T engine was possibly ruined from water damage could the tractor be saved by using a local free 4G D4 short motor as a donor, or if not being a purist, could you simply bolt a complete RD4 engine with radiator onto a 5T transmission, is that possible?
As I stated, complete assemblies would interchange but individual parts particularly on the engine may not. Yes a complete engine would interchange. Parts books and s/n's would tell the story.
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Mon, Jul 17, 2017 12:07 PM
catsilver
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Reply to Old Magnet:
As I stated, complete assemblies would interchange but individual parts particularly on the engine may not. Yes a complete engine would interchange. Parts books and s/n's would tell the story.
Complete units can be swapped round but the track frames don't swap because the final drive outer bearing hubs are different.
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Mon, Jul 17, 2017 5:16 PM
Mike Meyer
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Reply to catsilver:
Complete units can be swapped round but the track frames don't swap because the final drive outer bearing hubs are different.
While working on my D4 2T and D4 7J restorations I've needed to find a lot of parts and it is interesting to see the evolution of these early D4 crawlers and how many bits they share, I also have a nice 4G D4 I use here on the farm regularly so have the opportunity to compare machines in the flesh, the 7J needed all new bearings and seals in the tranny along with a new crown wheel and pinion and I ended up using a crown wheel set out of a D4 6U which fitted fine.

I know here in Oz if I was lucky enough to inherit a D4 5T and there was the opportunity to grab a free 4G D4 just down the road I'd be all over it like a rash particularly if I wasn't too fussed if the serial number tags didn't match, like if I needed to switch in a different motor to get her running, the 2T and 7J are both getting new cylinder liners, rings and reconditioned heads amongst a heap of other new parts and rebuilding these old girls is expensive if you do it right, much easier and cheaper to drop a complete running engine onto the tranny and get going.
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Tue, Jul 18, 2017 3:46 AM
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